Atlas reefers as a good base

After a long time Atlas brought a second batch of these Decker reefers on market.

Nice to see however not often in reality - cars with roof lettering.

Unfortunately, the details are looking a bit too toy-like.

How correctly are the details at underbody? (Picture shows a very similarly model with a different paint/lettering.)

The frame is looking like a steel frame? Ok, for a 1925 model. However equipped with truss rods and turnbuckles? And truss rods bent to the bottom? Why?
And look these turnbuckles. Full blocks of plastic!

No, that all is not good enough and I would like to own models close to 1900. But these Atlas models are a very good base for changing them to very well detailed models of that era.

Can't wait

to see what you do with these. Bernd you are doing a great job re-detailing those RTR cars and making them look like fine quality models. I really enjoy your posts. I sure hopes others do to.

Bernd

Toy like?

I would not call those details toy like. I would consider them a compromise between detail and survivability on a layout. For most folks the representation offered would be quite acceptable. Also keep in mind the magnification needed to find the inaccuracies those cars are more than double the size of the actual model on my computer screen. Now when one compares them to your work, work that would shame many museum pieces, they will fall short in a great many areas.

I would say the items you have been building are fantastic and way beyond the capabilities of most folks, which is one reason many of us appreciate it so much is we know that is something we will never equal.

Rob in Texas

Thank you, Bernd and Rob!

Thank you, Bernd and Rob!

Rob, maybe you are right. First time that I have seen such a model with a roof lettering was in a video of Tim Warris' famous Bronx Terminal layout. And not before third or fourth viewing I detected that this model was an Atlas model whereof I have rebuilt four pieces already a good time ago. Long time I tried to receive (unsuccessfully) such models and I was shortly before to build my own models when Atlas sold the second batch of these 36' reefer models. So I knew what I ordered.

I would like to say that these models are a mixture of very fine model work and I say it again, combined with toy-like parts. The brake was one of these well designed and very fine molded parts. The frame has been reduced to a minimum of parts without an only rivet head, however that was the only connecting method of steel in 1925, the delivery year that is printed on models.
Unfortunately Atlas added doors which was designed for opening. So Atlas must add extreme enlarged door hinges for implementing this function. And so that the general view looks not florid, only four hinges per door were realized, not six, as it would be necessary on cars of 1925.

These three facts, the very simple frame, movable door wings together with the over-dimensioned hinges make these models very close to toy-like for me. Atlas could have developed very good models if all parts had been constructed like the brake and a few other parts as real model parts. And thus these reefers are not this, unfortunately, from what a modeler dreams, good models for an reasonable price.
And these models were also not quite cheap! However I wrote it already before, I knew what I did order and I knew that I could change these models to very good looking reefer models. And that I have done! And with it the next pictures should follow.

model source

Hi Bernhard

Your models are excellent.  

Last year I came across a man who produces early railcar kits on a limited run, by order only, basis.  I have not ordered from him yet because his kits appear to be of late 1800 era cars and I was wanting to model the 1920's although I may need to alter that now.  That may fit into your era ok.   Anyway his name is John Canfield, his email is jcan2x at hotmail.com.  I don't think he has a website, but here is a link to one of his models:  http://www.nyow.org/Articles/Butterdish/butterdish.html. He only makes kits that he has orders for so he has no backstock.  If you are interested, send him an email and get on his mailing list for future offerings.

Anyway, your modeling is great and we are all glad to have you posting here on MRH.

Link is not working

Jim, something is wrong with the link, can't connect.

Reefers - backdating to 1900

Already the last post declares what I would like to change - first the frame, with this a new brake, and thereafter the doors.

All parts of brake and frame were removed and I did prepare a 3-point suspension by gluing these four white plastic parts on body bolsters.

This is the new frame, a real wood frame that I built from North Eastern strip wood and glued on original metal base.

Three new brake gears are ready for mounting. These gears here are not exactly same parts that I have used for the Decker reefers however all my brake gears are looking very similarly and were built from wire, metal strips and medical canulas. And they have a specific property - all levers and rods are loosely riveted and so they are movable.

Together with four prepared truss rods ...

... the underbodies are completed.

With this work I have received real old frames with all under-floor details and so the first step was done for backdating of these cars near to 1900 era.

If you would like to read how I make the truss rods, please read my description in The Keystone Modeler - spring 2014 and go to page 22, where I have written about my ship propeller load. Download here PDF-File.

Bernhard, those models are

Bernhard, those models are just beautiful. It is really inspiring to watch such fine work take place. At the rate your going you will probably find a way to get the brakes to work before it is all done.

Thanks for sharing.

Rob in Texas

@Rob, thanks. I'm sure that

@Rob, thanks.
I'm sure that not all will go and - who can see that yet? However I can turn the hand brake wheel at my old rail gondolas - and the levers move, a bit.

@Nick, Check this correction - http://www.nyow.org/Articles/Butterdish/butterdish.html. There was a blank at end.

@Jim, thanks also for your hint.
I have studied this website of O&W historical society many times already, because I repaired and detailed three of those old 27' gondolas of NYO&W in last time and this project is in progress yet. So I did read also this specific modeling page from John Canfield and I found also this very fine Borden's milk car on his page.

However, and I have written this in an other thread already. I have so many projects in my head that I can not plan more yet. And all these ideas are scratch build projects which need a lot of time. And second, my work room is fulfilled with kits and boxed that I never will find an end with work.

However, and I have written this in an other thread already. I have so many projects in my head that I can not plan more yet. And all these ideas are scratch build projects which need a lot of time. And second, my work room is fulfilled with kits and boxed that I never will find an end with work.

And last, a lot of steam engines are waiting for a rebuilding and digitalizing.

Bad link

Sorry about the bad link, but I see Bernhard has already fixed it. 

...

I believe more research would answer your questions...there was a crossover period where under frames consisted of both steel and truss rods...  Why? Well, for the obvious reason, greater load capacity, and if you look at that under frame as it was originally modeled, you might see it's just a straight beam without any vertical shape.  Look at a 40' AAR and you'll find the under frame is a truss.

Comment?

Benny, ok.
I accept 36' cars with steel frames and truss rods.

However I would like to see your pictures/links of 40' AAR boxcars with truss rods. Already in Car Builders' Cyclopedia 1922 you can find only two cars equipped with truss rods, one is a boxcar with steel center sills, not a steel frame, and other is a flat car for container loads. And that is long time before AAR.

But ...

This was my second question! Definitively a wrong modeling! I'm sorry, I can not find an other answer.

...

I don't have pictures or links of either, but I have run into enough stuff in my time to know that just because I personally have not found a reference or seen it in person yet, that does not mean it doesn't exist.  It simply means I have to do more research.

Modelwise, the truss rods are probably bent up to clear the wheels of the truck.  But with that being said, I would not be able to say cars like that were not built, whereas I don't have a pile of pictures to go through from 1900-1940.  I do know thousands of cars were built in that timeframe by a very large number of builders, and it's quite possible there were cars built with the truss rods bent in that manner - and then bent again when they meet the cross member at the floor.

Your upgrades are coming along very nicely, by the way.

Benny, thanks!

Thanks for your comment!

You are right, there were many things, many different solutions for solving a specific problem. I and many of my friends say often about uncommon looking things that we found somewhere. "There is nothing what there is not." (I hope that will be an adequate translation of our German phrase. "Es gibt nichts, was es nicht gibt.") Or in other words, everything is possible.

However in case of these truss rods of these Atlas models - there were not others than the apprehension or fear that truss rods could hinder the truck swiveling. I demonstrate with my well working straight rods going until to car bolsters that Atlas has not made not a very cogent job.

But in next post I will show more pictures again.

Now, after frame rebuilding ...

Now, after frame rebuilding the doors should get their new look!

Look here and in next picture these clodhopping parts! I did not like to have doors which are ready for opening. I prefer to own a well detailed model - and I would like to say it again, that these Atlas reefers are a very good base for this.

First steps and tests of rebuilding.

From left.

• Old original hinges, the dismountable body mounted parts.
• Left door wing for tests with white plastic fillers in future position.
• A new door latch (Grandt Line part #5167) fixed yet onto sprue. With the result that I must cut these in three parts for use.
• Right door wing with old original details including the wing part of hinges which were injected as one part.

The door wings get their new look. Unfortunately a few damages are not avoidable.

And that is what I would like to get! Reefer doors with six hinges (also Grandt Line parts) in correct dimension which I fixed temporarily onto a side wall.

Next step was a correction of damaged paint (without the door hardware) and that was the work of a friend who is a fantastic painter. My friend and me are working corporate at this project and at end he will get one of these models for his own collection. The last steps are now only a question of times.

Age of cars

Quick spotting features for earlier era cars are the grab irons.  The modern grab iron arrangement was in force in 1906.  Before that cars typically had grab irons on either the end of the car or the sides but not both.  Ladders tended to be used on the ends of the cars but not the sides and ladders tended to have wooden rungs or steps.  Pre-1906 open top or tank cars also tended to have vertical hand holds on the corners with a ladder arrangement (metal rungs) on the ends.  Cars frequently only had a sill step on the corners where there was a ladder, the other corner had no sill step.  These are all generalizations, pre-WW1 car designs were all over the place.

Another spotting feature of older cars is the dimensional data, I believe the "CAPY.... LD LMT...." stenciling was post-1910. 

Another somewhat more technical aspect is that older cars with wooden underframes tended to have the the end sill above the coupler pocket while cars with steel underframes and end sills tended to have the coupler pocket in the end sill.  Cars built pre-1900 would also have buffer blocks on either side of the coupler on the end sill. 

Age of cars

Dave, thanks!

You are right. With last paint all lettering mistakes were corrected however we did not change ladders and handrails. At the end there will be always some compromises. I see this also relatively loose. In my train of 1900 are running always cars which were built late in 1910 or a little bit later also. Therefore, I mostly write about my 1900 (+) train.

But your hint will be good for next projects where I should watch on this a bit more. Thanks again.

Finished!

Last pictures before paint correction.

You see here especially the changes and added parts at B-end of models. Must I declare this? All parts without color are new or replaced, including yet a too long brake staff at model in middle.

And now the parade of the three models - fresh from the car painter shop.

Can you read the erecting date - new 7-05? Now models are ready to run with my 1900 (+) train.
And because my only loco (in moment) for this train was built in 1907 than was this car already not longer a new one. So a bit dust should be added, I think.

A special thank to my friend Joerg in Leipzig, Germany for his very good paint job and his photos!

Your Modeling

Bernd,

Your modeling makes me want to back date my layout to be to that area. I really like what you have done with ordinary cars. Can't wait to see when you get the articulated engine completed.

Bernd

P.S. kind of strange writing to myself.

Thanks, ...

Thanks, Bernd.

The VGN class AE will need a good lot of time. Until today I did not more as I have written, planning, collecting of ideas and how to do. Before starting I would like to close two car projects yet or if there will come longer breaks.

Thanks for your interest!