There and back again

to quote a certain hobbit.  I have a love of passenger trains.  I'd love to have space to have a large passenger terminal and run some from town to town.  I went through many iterations of using my space to accomplish just that, but in the end, I just wasn't satisfied with any of them for various reasons.  It became apparent that I wasn't giong to get a satisfactory layout with a large passenger station in my available space without compromising other things, such as a place to run them TO.

And the more I played with my switching layout, the more I kind of like the idea of just switching a few cars, spending maybe 30-60 minutes when I have some time running trains, dropping and picking up cars.  What if I added just a small passenger train or even RDC into the mix?  I could have a small town run with only a few cars and just switch them out with the various cars that I have.  It would also mean I don't need as many cars - a cost saving!  

These ideas were the genesis of where I'm at today.  A plan-in-the-making:

This is the lower level, or what may be the only level - that is still to be determined.  Instead of the helix at the bottom, it may just be a return loop with some staging, but that is a ways off yet.  If I do build the second level, it will probably look something like this:

Alright skiloff!

Keep your camera at the ready and post those photos so we can follow along. Looking forward to it!

TOMA

As you can probably tell, this is shaping up to be my foray into TOMA.  It will be a series of 2x4 foot modules that will begin with the four on the top right side.  You might recognize the two middle modules as an Inglenook.  Starting there, I get some switching right away and get to delve into the scenic elements quicker as there isn't a lot of track.  Scenery is still my favourite part of the hobby, other than running trains.  

I'll post regular updates as we go, and who knows?  Maybe you'll see the odd article in the pages of MRH.

Some nice looking long curves

Some nice looking long curves there, Dave. What will the radiuses be?

Have you thought about the corners

With a very small addition/change and wont take away from your TOMA approach I think you can make the corners nicer. I've roughly drawn, in magenta below, what I'm suggesting - An even nicer solution, given you have some nice long curves, is to cove the inner corners and radius the large outer - rather than I've shown. The one that jumps out the most is the outer corner in middle of layout - this one particulalrly would be nice with a borad curve and would mean you ar less likely to snag the corner too.

Simon

Melbourne Australia

Answers

Deemiorgos - The minimum radius is 26", but most are 29.5" or larger.  The helix is actually the 26" radius, which is one of the reasons I'm trying to decide if I'll bother at all with a second deck.

Simon - It is quite likely I will do as you describe.  The plan is to get the first four modules finished then fix them in place with some screws, then do a couple more, expanding from that right wall down the top wall, then going the other way.  Once the modules are fixed in place (with screws, so they are easy to take apart later), then I'll run a fascia along it and curve the fascia in the inside corners.  That one outside curve module you've got cut off that leads towards the helix/staging will probably get cut off as well, but I'm considering my scenic options there, but it could easily be two years before I have to worry about that.

Purpose

So what is the purpose, the "raison d'être" for this fairly small layout?  The answer is pretty simple - to entertain me.  I can come up with a back story and all that, but I'm trying to combine my interests into a somewhat plausible layout.  Those main interests are:

1) Passenger trains - even small passenger trains amuse me, and there will be regular runs on this little layout, even if a prototype wouldn't run that many on a small branch line like this.

2) Barge/carfloat - my first (and still only) ops session was on Rich Branch's Greenpoint Dock and Transfer company layout, and I knew I had to incorporate some kind of carfloat/barge operation at some point.  The top left area of the layout (on the lower deck) will be a little barge operation, somewhat like used on the Slocan in interior British Columbia.  

3) Simple switching - I don't want paperwork on my layout at this stage and I like that I have an inglenook to start with so I can do some switching, or even the switching puzzle for a change of pace when I feel like it (or have guests do the switching puzzle when they come over).  Other switching is possible and I still might add more on the bottom area instead of the helix if I decide to not do the top deck.  Or maybe I will and do the top deck later.  I'm not locking myself into anything at this stage, and that's the beauty of TOMA.  I can pull something out that I no longer have interest in and put something else back in it's place.  

4) Mountain scenery - I grew up just outside the Jasper park gates near Hinton, AB.  The mountains will always be a part of me and I loved watching trains go over high bridges or through tunnels.  My Dad worked as a cook in the camp for those building the Trans Canada highway through Roger's Pass and he had endless stories of the railroads in the mountains and the spiral tunnels.  The pictures don't show it, but the helix is only a two or three turn, while a good chunk of the rise is a nolix, rising from the barge area up to the top level.  This allows short, one engine trains, but even short trains could use an extra loco or two.  Scenery is still my favourite thing to do and I look forward to doing mountain scenery and taking photos of the trains in that scenery.

These are the main points of interest for me that I've tried to work within to achieve what I think will be long-term satisfaction.

Following along

Dave;

I really like the simple approach and, like you, I love the mountain scenery and rail barge concept. My little side adventure into TOMA was compelling enough that new ideas for my current layout have sprouted in my mind so your post adds fuel to the fire. I look forward to your posts. 

Congratulations Dave!

Congratulations Dave!  Nice to see what you're up to.  Your lower level looks like it'd be fun to scenic and operate.  Nice open spaces and an uncrowded track schematic.

A few thoughts:

• Have you considered narrowing your benchwork where you can?  Seems like 12-18" depth might work well for you in most places, reducing lumber and scenery costs and improving accessibility and maintainability.
• Reducing the length of the passing siding on your upper level (to the right of your desk) would allow more open running and shouldn't impact operation of what I'm assuming would be relatively short branchline trains.
• Is that big yard exclusively for staging?  Given what I'm assuming will be fairly light traffic requirements, you may find that having a big staging yard may not necessarily be the way to go.  I built a 10-track staging yard at a time when I intended to model a period of the IAIS when as many as 8 UP detours a day were running.  Later, I moved my era forward to a much quieter time, and could now easily get by with half the staging I have.  (I must be the only exception to Tony Koester's comments about us always needing more staging than we planned.  )

Anyway, while it's nice to have room for my entire rolling stock and locomotive rosters in staging, it would have been far cheaper to go smaller, and the equipment could have been better-protected from dust if I'd stored it in drawers instead.  Both methods have their advantages - just wanted to mention it so you consider your options before building.

• If you retain the upper level, but minimize your staging, you'd probably have room for another town below your desk in that plan, so the helix and second level may still be worth your while. 
• However, if you choose a single level, I wonder if you could eliminate the helix and swing a staging track or two under your stairway, building your inbound train on the visible layout and then shoving it back under the stairs before ops begin.

Where is Hinton AB?

Where is Hinton AB? Just curious to get idea of the geography etc of the area.

Hinton, Alberta

I believe it's here:

Joe

It's very interesting to hear your perspective and how much your thoughts have mirrored mine.

Narrowing the benchwork - very much considered that and it's still not off the table, but so far I like the idea of having all of them the same.  I don't mind doing a lot more scenery and stripping down a module to redo it, I think I will just reuse the frames.  This way, the extra space will provide options in the future.

The upper deck was something I put together last night and in no way consider it a final plan.  When I finished it, I thought the yard was bigger than it needed to be.  The upper deck is also where I more seriously consider 12-18" benchwork, though I also like the idea of the same widths to provide lighting for the lower deck.  In short, the upper deck is merely an idea at this stage and have no doubt it will change if I do eventually build it.  The bottom deck is not set in stone, either, but it is much closer.

I will be putting temporary staging in place at the bottom of the lower level and time will tell if it remains permanent.  I had designs on designing that lower staging so that when it's time, I could transfer that to the upper deck to be that yard.  Still might do that.  It could be the end of the line that keeps getting put back along the length as I finish modules.

You got it, Jeff

Coal and lumber country just outside the Jasper National Park - one of the most beautiful places in the world.  My parents operated and then partly owned this place - where I spent the first nearly 5 years of my life.  It is about 1km from the Jasper Park gates.  

Overlander

Nice! What a beautiful spot. I imagine that winter must be amazing as well.

Thank you

Thank you for clarifying for me. As a USAF vet I quickly read AB as AFB and was not familiar with location. My bad but yes beautiful country. Love mountains which is one reason I live in Western North Carolina

Indeed, Neil

It was about a half hour drive to Marmot Basin for downhill skiing and my Dad and his friends hosted snowmobilers almost every weekend at the lodge.  Dad and his friends would cut more than 100 miles of snowmobile trails each fall through the bush outside the park for the snowmobilers.  I don't remember it getting really cold (and by that I mean -30C or colder), but I'm sure it did regularly, but the chinooks would come in, too, and you'd have warm temperatures with all that snow.  

It was also less than 2 miles to the CN mainline and you could hear the trains off in the distance, especially at night.  

Some Modifications

It's always good to mock things up to see exactly if what you see in your mind's eye can match reality.  Turns out, it didn't for me with the 24" module depth, so I've modified the plan to 18" depth for the modules.  I also cut out the long passing siding on the lower deck as it seemed there for convenience and likely couldn't be justified for a few trains a day.  

Here is the new lower level:

Preparing the space

To begin with, I had to clean up the area where the layout will be.  This meant dismantling the three module setup I have had, as well as finding better places for things.  You can see the mess here:

One of the thing I realized I needed to do in order to reorganize this room was also to reorganize the garage to store some of the tools that found their way down to the basement.  After accomplishing that task, I determined I wanted to easily stack and organize things, so you can see I began purchasing a few Rubbermaid containers each week home and putting things away.  A label maker is a very handy tool, and I even ran out of the label roll, so I have to pick up another one at Staples.

Progress

Made some more progress.  I had my wife help me go through stuff that had been sitting in the basement essentially since we moved into this house 10 years ago.  It's a good exercise, as we now can get rid of a number of things we obviously don't need.  Finding a new place for it might be a bit more challenging, but hopefully the ReStore or Goodwill will find good homes for some of the things.  Other stuff will just go to the trash.  Here is what it looks like today:

And the big desk (below) that will be moved into the middle of the room was covered in, well, stuff.  Got some into boxes to be sorted and will be put into the Rubbermaid containers or sent to the trash or Goodwill or something, then I can move the desk into the middle of the room and finish the room reorganization and begin construction!

I do have to ask

Good question

This is very likely to be a lone wolf operation and I haven't yet decided if I'll do the second deck or not.  I may just have another yard on the "bottom" part, mostly for staging.  I'm really going to see how the lower deck does for me and go from there.

Looking good, Dave.One

Looking good, Dave.

One benefit from having the narrower build is that it will also make it easier to get some nice trackside photos and videos from low vantage points. Only a minor issue perhaps, but something I wish I could manage on mine.

Mike

I will be using 2 stacked

I will be using 2 stacked yards on my layout.  The key to this working is have them worked from the opposite ends of the stacked yards or have the operating spot for each yard located in the body area of the yard other yard.

I would have a runaround

I would have a runaround track on the layout. With industries to be switched it allows trains to be pulled in and sidings to be worked and the train can go back with out long back up moves. In many cases long back up moves maybe a potential safety risk. It may also speed up the work a great deal allowing for more productivity by the crew.