ChrisNH

I have just completed installing a base for my water feature. Its 1/4" plywood supported on the edge of the facia and by risers attached to joists at six points. I sealed it with gloss medium which needs sanding again. Learning point- install bases for water feature BEFORE installing facia! This was a real pain the butt.

 Thanks to some helpful suggestions I am going to try to do the scene using Acrylic Gloss Medium. I will paint the sealed board a nice dark blue to black with some lighter colors near the shore. The ROW will be on a causeway along the edge of the river. Thickly forested scenery will extend down to the water on a slope. When the camera is facing the bridge perpindicular to the water it should be framed entirely with trees. Good thing I have plenty of super trees.

Inspirations for this scene:

http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?2003110714511910953.jpg

http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?2005041422143822936.jpg

http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?200711171118012047.jpg

Regards,

Chris

“If you carry your childhood with you, you never become older.”           My modest progress Blog

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joef

Looking good!

Chris:

This is looking good ... I love seeing photos! Before and after photos are fun, and a few step-by-step photos can be especially fun.

Are you planning to do scenery around the causeway next? Just wondering, because if I were doing this, I'd add next add the bridge abutments, rough in the terrain, add rocks, dirt, and ballast the track. Then I'd do the water. Finally, I'd add the vegetation and other scene details to finish it up.

The terrain, rocks, dirt, and ballasting are all messy operations and should be done first. I presume you had that in mind, but I thought I would ask.

Joe Fugate​
Publisher, Model Railroad Hobbyist magazine

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Marty McGuirk

 Chris,    Looking good -

Chris, 

Looking good - nice to see people making progress - your Harvest Gold '38s are going to look great winding through those curves. 

Agree with what Joe says - do the messy work first, water last. Remember the matte medium we use to hold the scenery in place is going to dry flat - and it WILL get onto the water surface! 

Also, not sure why you're putting down a gloss surface at this point (it won't hurt, but I think  it may be a waste of effort).  

Don't paint the water blue - real water isn't really blue - and model water painted blue very rarely, if ever, looks right. Paint the water black for the deepest sections, with some "feathering" of a slightly darker version of your earth colored paint on the banks. 

Marty

Marty McGuirk, Gainesville, VA

http://www.centralvermontrailway.blogspot.com

 

Reply 0
joef

As to color ...

As to color, Marty's right, straight blue doesn't really look right for modeled water. However ...

I've found adding a bit of blue to the other colors I use for water helps - that is when the water is fairly clear and free of silt (more about silt-laden water later).

For the deepest areas, I will make them blue-black, midnight blue, if you will. Then I will take the dirt color along the banks, add just a few drops of blue-black, and then paint it along the shore. I blend in a bit more blue-black as the water gets deeper, until it blends completely into the blue-black of the deepest areas.

Don't add very much blue - it needs to have just enough blue that it looks like an ever-so-slighly bluish black.

Using a few drops of blue-black makes the shallows along the shore look wet (even when you can't see the reflected gloss), and contrasts nicely with the dry dirt color above the water line.

Regarding silt-laden water, depending on the level of silt in the water, you can pretty much throw the whole black/blue-black water coloration method out the window. Lightly silt-laden water can look anywhere from dark olive green to dark red-brown in the deep areas. Heavy silt-laden water has almost no sense of depths or shallows and is generally some shade of mud brown - from red mud to yellow mud, depending on the color of silt source.

Many Oregon streams and rivers have some amount of silt in them, so dark olive green to green blue in the depths actually looks correct. Notice the color of my North Umpqua River in the scene below - this is modeled from photographs of the river. The North Umpqua is snowbank-fed and has a distinctly blue-green silt coloration, so locals can quickly tell this is a model of the North Umpqua. The spring-fed South Umpqua silt creates a much more olive green color to the South fork:

vista1.jpg 

 

And here's a photo of the actual North Umpqua river for comparison:

 

And here's the South Umpqua for comparison:

Of course, colors can shift in photos, but trust me, these two photos are a fairly accurate representation of the silt coloration of these two river forks - the South Umpqua River water is more yellow-green. By paying close attention to modeling river coloration, you can get an accurate model of water that even the locals will believe. The presence of silt in the water can give each body of water a unique coloration that's different from the generic black/blue-black approach for the deep areas.

Joe Fugate​
Publisher, Model Railroad Hobbyist magazine

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ChrisNH

Definitely mostly black

Thanks for all the advice and encouragement, Joe & Marty!

I was definitely planning to be more black then blue. I will make sure I do even more so, doubly so since I have such blue layout lighting. I am thinking I will need to use a piece of scrap wood and practice a bit until I get it right.

The more I study the first photo (my actual prototype), the more I realize that it is a bit underexposed which is hiding subtle colors and is ephasizing the blue. I do wonder if it  would be more of a very dark brown or a very dark green when I am actually standing on the banks. Algae is very common in due to phosphates leaking into the slower streams unfortunately. This makes the middle of the water appear to be a very dark shade of olive drab like the silt you describe above. I will try to find more reference photos. Unfortunately my upcoming trip to Vermont will bring me to the location of the rivers of my next layout more so then this one.

As for the scenery I am planning to do the water near the end. I will do the scenic form and zip texturing inclding the causeway first. I plan to paint a base coat before I do the vegetation.. but I am planning on doing the final color and the gloss as the very last step in the scene. Once its all done I can come back in with some shore rocks and grass to cover up any oopsies.

The bridge abutments are something of a problem for me. There is no commercial product available that is quite what I want. I also set the water a little too low for the scene creating a lot of distance under the bridge (Guess its been a dry August..) requiring more abutment which may look awkward. I hope not. I may have to try carving it out of plaster or foam. I will need to have that in place and my bridge at least fitted before I finalize the ends of the causeway.

Marty- I sealed the wood per Dave Frary's 2nd edition scenery book. I may have still been carrying his directions for epoxy water in my head. It seemed a nice way to protect the wood from the water base glues and plaster I will be putting down. Its thin wood and I don't want it to warp. I had a heck of a time getting it level. Besides doing it before the facia, next time I am going to run some 1x2 under it to help provide stiffness and use that to attach the supports underneath. I am also hoping the surface will take paint better although gesso may have been a better choice for that.

Thanks again for the help! While it is the B&M line, I have every intention of photographing my MEC GPs in there.. the colors will go very nice for the "almost fall" scene!

Chris

 

“If you carry your childhood with you, you never become older.”           My modest progress Blog

Reply 0
CSXDixieLine

Great Looking Scene

Chris, That is a great scene you are modeling and you have created an excellent focal point out of a basic turn back curve area. I have a similar causeway to model on my n-scale model and will be using construction similar to yours, so the picture you have posted is very helpful in giving me a mental image of how my scene should come together. By the way, if you are unhappy with the height of the bridge over the river bed, perhaps you could build up the river bed with additional 1/4" plywood? The only reason I suggest this is because I have a few bridge scenes where I am going to try to get the scale bridge height as close to the prototype as possible so everything stays proportionally correct and the finished scene looks like the real thing. Also, since your bridge is pretty low, the non-prototypical height will be more noticeable than if you were modeling a higher bridge. Of course, to me the scene looks great even when compared to the prototype pictures you provided. Looking forward to watching this scene moving forward! Jamie

By the way, as I post on this site and see my comments mixed in with thoselike Joe & Marty's, I feel like the amateur poker player sitting down at a table with all the stars!

Reply 0
ChrisNH

Thanks for the comment!

Thanks for the comment! Glad I could provide some helpful pics.

Addding another layer of plywood isnt a bad idea. It would also bring the water up to the lip of the facia rather then the 3/8" under from when I was planning to do envirotex. So much of this could have been avoided if I had put the water together right after I did roadbed rather then after the facia.

I will have to ponder that. I am inclined to leave it as-is in the interest of "moving on" since the purpose here is to learn and that will be served either way.

On the subject of causeways.. here are a couple that are of the abandoned (now rail trail) Rutland line through the Champlain Islands that is more of a granite block construction that might be of interest depending on what your goal is..

http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?2002092219534820623.jpg

http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?2002082617130726920.jpg

http://photos.nerail.org/showpic/?200707231356128340.jpg

Regards,


Chris

 

“If you carry your childhood with you, you never become older.”           My modest progress Blog

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