That is what makes this hobby great!

That you enjoy more the modeling, and don't see the model as the means to and end.  But for me, this hobby is all ABOUT Operation, and the models is the means to reach that end.  Now I do enjoy long tall bridges, and huge steel mill complexs, and so forth, but the driving thrust for my enjoyment of the Hobby is following the prototype as much as one can without making it too much like work.  So there does need to be a balance, but one of my enjoyments is operating in a TT&TO system, where you're the local, and you have to decide can you make the switch moves you need to in town, and still clear the main 15 minutes before the Train #9 comes through town (which is Superior to your train).  Now for some, they don't want to deal with that, it's too much like work.  That's fine, this after all is a HOBBY, so if you don't enjoy that part that's ok.   No one should ever say "THIS IS THE ONLY WAY THINGS SHOULD BE DONE".  Unfortunately, there are some in the hobby who absolutely think that, and they judge everything to that "standard".  Then there are those who accuse others of having that attitude, when they really don't, even though they strongly advocate for a particular way of modeling, they would never say that to do otherwise is "wrong". But that's a whole separate matter.

Ken L.

I agree completely.

I discovered when I joined a modular club, that I don't care about watching a train run in circles no matter how big the circle is.  One of the guys has a 10 foot long switching module set based on the "Gump Stump" from 101 Railroads You Can Build.  It is closer to a switching puzzle than a true to prototype industrial switching district, but I can spend hours switching it.  I enjoy using the car cards when we do an operating session at a set up, but my LAJ switching layout will not use any paperwork.  I can spot cars and pull them and take them back to the yard for hours without needing paper work.  I will be running 1990's on the Los Angeles Junction with a Cf7 diesel.  I run some steam on the modular set ups, but I want to run some more modern equipment on my home layout, but no stack trains, no unit trains, none of the stuff that modern class one railroading has become.  The LAJ is a subsidiary of the BNSF whose total area is located in a space @ 10 miles by 10 miles, and they handle local switching for the BNSF & U.P. in the Vernon and City of Commerce area near Los Angeles.

A model railroad marriage

Wouldn't it be great if model railroaders could win the right to marry?  Some couples would be nothing but builders, others just operation, but I think a truly great couple would be one highly skilled model builder and one great operator.  Together, they could enjoy creating the greatest, most prototypical, and hopefully most satisfying layout the world has known.

Well, they'd need money, too, but when you have love....

Right on !!

I agree with you 100%. I love model railroading,this is supposed to afun and relaxing hobby. But there is to much you shouldn't use this or that and that is not the year, your track doesn't have the proper detail. I think that you should do what you want and use what want to get to where you want to be in the hobby! Dont take this the wrong way,ask questions and get advise on things. Just because it didn't work on soinso's layout or scenery don't mean it won't work on yours. Sometimes people forget that every one does not have the large buget to do this hobby like the well knows around the country. Do what makes you happy.

Dave Aarons

Cranes??

Sheesh, I thought that was what rerailer Frogs are for!! ;P

In regards to your last paragraph, the way I see it today is like Fishing.  A lot of people think the whole point of fishing is Catching the Fish.  And all they want to do is sit and catch fish - cast, catch, cast, catch.  That's it. And the same follows for Model railroading - a lot of people think the whole point is operating the model railroad, and they just want to run the thing.  So when you tell them you went out fishing all day and didn't even throw out a single cast, they look at you cockeyed and say "Then what did you do???" and then when you come back after a long day without a single fish, after trolling all day long, they look at you again and ask, "Just why do you go out fishing, anyways??"

So when they ask "how big is your layout" and I say "I don't have one," they look at me cockeyed...and I laugh.

I fully agree with everybody else, I LOVE Catching the fish.  But the actual part of catching the fish is just a tiny segment of the experience - and for me, that small event never even need happen to get that experience, either - once you've caught a fish from one lake, it's not much different catching it in any other lake!

Hobby time

I understand exactly what your saying. I work in radio communications, been there 17 years now. I am also a extra class Amateur Radio Operator. My off time is not spent with a radio unless Im in the mood and some people dont understand that.

I saw the same with my father when he was a Police Officer, the last thing he wanted to talk about was police stuff.

For you its good that you can find the hobby and enjoy it, as a release, and appreciate the history.

Hobby time is precious time, we all have different ideals of what our trains should, could and would be, I think sometimes we get so wrapped in details we forget it is a hobby.

I know for myself, my blood pressure probably drops 10 points just walking into the layout room.

This is why model railroading

This is why model railroading is such a great hobby. We all get something different out of it. I happen to love putting 2 long trains on my double track loop and let them run. I can watch them for hours (may explain the relative lack of progress on the rest of the layout). I do enjoy "operating" the layout also. Usually just randomly switching industries though. One day I may make up a switch list and see how that goes.

Some of us enjoy tracklaying, others the electronics, structure building, superdetailing rolling stock or locomotives. Bottom line, enjoy the hobby the way YOU want to. There is no right or wrong way to have fun, just have fun and relax.

Rule 1. It's my railroad. I

Rule 1. It's my railroad. I own it, I run it. I'm the Boss.

Rule 2. You don't like the way I run my railroad? Refer rule 1.

Like your reply ejholden...

The other question is.  Are you in Australia?  Your username does have a "very" distinctive Australian name to it...

Jas...

Another Railroader Likes Steam

I was helping restore N&W 611 at the time of the NS merger, then went with the road crew on NKP 765 for a brief tour of the country.  Now I work as a locomotive engineer for BNSF.  The challenge of Steam Locomotive Operation is what I would like to model.  "Stack talk" tells what the steam locomotive is doing in response to control settings.  There are no EM computers deciding how to respond to adjustments.  Without dynamic brakes, it was essential to master the Automatic Air Brake and work it against the throttle to keep the slack under control.  There was this thing called a caboose where the grumpy Conductor would ride and critique the performance and ancestry of the Engineer... especially if poor train handling sent everything and everyone onto the floor of the caboose!  Now there are automatic downloads of the event recorder that are processed by a computer to rat on an engineer that might stretch brake through a sag going into a slow restriction.

The problem is how to get model Sound Systems to respond and work like actual railroad controls.  We really can't stretch brake into a restriction with a bunch of numbered buttons on a DCC control.  The ancient PFM sound system was good because it used analog controls with the biggest lever being the whistle works, so that the reverberation could be turned up and a lonesome whistle solo could be echoed down the canyon in the night.  And coming out of a restriction, the exhaust volume could be turned up to make it sound like the locomotive was working hard to restore speed.

The question is: would Train Handling Scenarios appeal to model railroaders, or is this just an obsession for a forgotten era?  

Right On!

Thank you, I enjoyed reading your blog! And I do agree with you completely. I recently read in a major competitor's magazine that some modelers would argue that if your railroad is not completely prototypical, than they wouldn't even consider it a real model railroad! To me that's just condescending and arrogant. If it has tracks that you can run a model train on, then it's a model railroad! IMHO anyway.

I have never worked around a railroad, know almost nothing about real trains, and my interest in operations is limited. I am fully into the construction of the layout itself. It gives me a chance to be creative, artistic, and create a small world of my very own! And to watch the trains go around, and pretend to drop off cars at businesses and pick them up, well that just makes the creation satisfying, to know that my work has been successful, and allows me to enjoy the layout in ways other than just staring at it. Running the trains brings the whole thing to life! It is the heart and soul of a model train empire, without it all you have is a diorama. And a diorama is nearly worthless unless it is a museum quality, totally accurate depiction of a past place of importance, to anyone else besides the creator that is. And as long as the creator is happy then who else matters? No one, that's who!

And that is why Model Railroading is such a successful hobby as an industry, it is so many things to so many people. There are those who are into the trains themselves, there are those who are into creating a small piece of history, and those who enjoy the electronics and computer animation, and those who are into the prototypical operations, and those like myself who are into the construction of it all. To see all the different pieces come together as a whole, and work as one. So it is a hobby that satisfies so many different kinds of people, and for one kind of person to judge another's layout as anything but what it is, a model railroad, is just wrong! again, IMHO. So thank you for sharing your personal experience and opinions on the hobby, it's refreshing to hear from someone who is so close to the prototype with such an open mind on the subject.  

Russell K.     N Scale modern era

RE: Right On! - alphaGT

A big Right On! to the Right On! What you just said (and said well) is exactly my feelings. It could have been me saying that if I had the literacy skills you do.

In a just and fair world alphaGT's post forever slams the door closed on the debates about layouts' existence.

Train Handling

I for one have spent a great deal of idle time trying to figure out how to accurately model train handling.  Maybe this is the subject for a different thread, or maybe not (being DIRECTLY related to my interest and experience as both a prototype and model railroader), but here's what I've come up with:

There are two main problems with train handling on a model railroad.  The first is that locomotives cannot freewheel.  Let off the power, they stop.  That means there is no real need for brakes, no dynamic braking, no stretch braking, nothing.  It's what we (at least locally) refer to as "Monkey Braking" - stopping with just the engine brake.  The other problem is that the cars have no brakes.  Without brakes of some sort, a freewheeling engine would result in a runaway, but you also cannot have a train stretched into a station.

Since slack handling and braking are the two primary aspects of train handling, and train handling is 95% of what an engineer does, there's no good way as our models exist today to do more than simulate train handling by playing games with the throttle.

I think I'll start a thread on an idea I've had for train brakes, and see if anybody is interested...

[edit]

I forgot the other main obstacle to train handling on a model railroad.  Good train handling really comes into play when there are a variety of grades and curves on a railroad.  Anybody can run a train on flat ground.  Most model railroads, with the exception of large club layouts, simply don't have the variety of grades to get the full benefit of train handling ability.