Not a Fan

I don't care for uncoupling magnets in any situation, especially not in an intense switching district.  They never seem to be where you really want them, as it's difficult to place one at every location where it will be desirable to uncouple cars.  You also have the problem of uncoupling happening when you don't want it. 

When working an industry track, you may find the need to couple and uncouple multiple times to handle various spots (for example, I have several tracks with 3-4 separate spots, and a few others with more).  Having magnets set up to handle all the permutations would be impractical.

I much prefer skewers.

Sometimes you just have to

go with magnets because you (I) built the darn spur out of reach.  If you can stay with skewers, do it, otherwise consider electromagnets.  The Kadee permanent magnets are likely to give you false uncoupling: electromagnets at least won't do that.

I make mine out of 1.5x2" steel plates separated by a 1" length of 1/4"x1/4" stock, wound full of No 28 enameled copper wire.  I find about 30 VDC sufficient to get pretty reliable uncoupling.  Don't forget a reverse-biased diode across each magnet, or your SPST switches won't last.

But if you can keep everything within reach of a skewer, that's the way to go!

David RT

From my experience

if you can reach without messing up your scenery use a skewer. If you can't reach use a magnet. But there are many different ways to mount them.

My track is down so I have to use above the track magnets. Had I planned ahead better I would have mounted the magnets under the track.

Delayed uncoupling

In places where I can't reach far enough to uncouple with a skewer I manually set the couplers for delayed uncoupling and drop the car where needed.  I normally build or operate on walk around layouts where I am close to the trains in any case.

Terry

Check previous threads...

Dear Matt,

Reccomend you check some previous threads,

https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/fine-tuning-couplers-how-do-i-cure-inadvertent-uncoupling-12187317

specifically

https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/fine-tuning-couplers-how-do-i-cure-inadvertent-uncoupling-12187317

and

https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/uncoupling-cars-12187719

Manual uncoupling picks (kebab skewers) work find on

http://carendt_backup.gully.org/scrapbook/page103a/index.html#chicago-fork
(both O and HO scale versions)

magnets work fine when tagged with drag-devices on

http://carendt_backup.gully.org/scrapbook/page87/index.html

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

thanks!

Thanks guys! I'll be taking your advice to heart as I move forward.  Every siding is easily in reach, so I may just go with skewers. 

30 Volts?

Hey David, how much wire are you winding on the metal and how far away is the magnet from the couplers that you need 30 volts to uncouple? That's a lot of voltage!

30 volts

To be honest, Ken, I don't really know how much wire there is on the coil.  I just kept on winding until it was full.  The top of the metal frame is at the level of the bottom of the ties.  I realize 30 volts is a bit of a jolt: with 15-16V I was getting about 80-90% reliable uncoupling and delayed uncoupling.  About half of the failures would uncouple ok but not deflect enough to use the delay feature which in my case is necessary.

30V came about because there was a second winding on the transformer, a hulking great thing that my dad wound about 50 years ago, and that's what the two in series gave me.  Things don't get warm, though; if I remember to get the clip-on ammeter off the boat I'll measure the current.

David

Electro Magnets

Ok, thanks. The reason I ask is that as far as I know, there are two ways to make an electro magnet stronger, either add more wire, or increase the voltage. I've been experimenting with 30 AWG wire around a nail, and I figure I've got about 12 feet of wire wrapped tightly around about 3 inches of nail, and with 1.5 volts, it's enough to pull the couplers to it from the rail. I haven't tried putting another nail on the other side yet, that comes next.

I have to be careful because even with just 1.5 volts, if the nail touches the coupler, the magnet is strong enough to pull a bunch of cars along the track.

Prototypical switching

I'm an engineer for ns.. few people realize this, but we use giant uncoupling magnets at every spot.  Makes for some interesting switching

...erm... no, wait, that's not right at all....

I really am an engineer, but the rest is BS..  you can uncouple a car anywhere you like.  For that reason alone, I prefer manual uncoupling.  In fact, I cut the hideous and problematic trip pins off my Kadee couplers, and leave them off my Accu-Mates.  They look better and uncouple just as well using skewers.

If you're designing a switching layout, don't design in a place you cannot reach.  It's like using a #3 turnout when your minimum is #8 - it WILL cause problems, and should not be done.  Saying that you have to do it in some situations is the same as saying you just have to use a curve or turnout that is too tight - redesign it, or live with a bad design.

Oh yerah..  I've been MRR'ing for over 2 decades, and I've never been a fan of magnetic uncoupling.  Aside from the operational hi-jinks, it simply doesn't work smoothly and reliably.  It's a PITA.

Ken Rickman

OK to have 1 electromagnet?

I have only a single spur on my track plan that is a bit of a reach. I plan to use an electromagnet on that spur. Is it logical to place the magnet at the switch end of the spur so cars can be uncoupled and then shoved into the industry? Is there a better place for the magnet?

I still wouldn't

I still wouldn't use a magnet at the location you've shown.  If you must, I'd use an electromagnet because any hesitation going over that turnout can cause an unwanted uncoupling.

I usually use skewers, however when I have had a spur too far away (about 30 inches) I used a Rix magnetic uncoupler fastened to a yard stick.  The Rix uncoupler has magnets on the sides but is open in the middle.  You place it between the cars and the magnets pull the couplers open.  It actually works better than the skewers, but skewers are pretty cheap.  Anyway, I have found that as long as you have access to the cars at a right angle, the Rix on a stick works quite well.

On a steeeck

Rix on a stick. Great idea. Thanks.

On a Steeek...

So are you a Jeff Dunham fan too? My wife hates him but two of my sons and I do like to watch him at work.

Irv

Steek

I had wondered how well the Rix uncoupler works, especially since it uses permanent magnets.

Jeff Dunham and Senor Whensis, "Jalopeno on a steek? 'salright!"

You need a steady hand

with the Rix uncoupler, at least steadier than mine.  I find it tends to attract all sorts of things other than the coupler - grab irons in particular, which seem to be magnetic on my older cars.  I'm impressed that one can make it work at the end of an extension.  I _think_ part of the answer is to make sure the Rix tool is firmly down on the railheads.  When it works, it definitely works.

But skewers is cheaper and surprisingly effective.

David RT

Electro Magnetic Uncoupler

I've been (slowly) working on an idea to create an uncoupling tool along the lines of the Rix tool, but using an electro magnet. Basically, you push the car where you want it, then place the tool between the cars and press a button. Pull the train forward, and leave the spotted cars.

Seems simple enough, but is still in R&D.

Sergent Couplers

Matt

Have you checked into the Sergent Couplers.  They are magnetic and use a small uncoupling wand.  I have not tried these yet, but I intend to use these, or at least try them,  when I start building cars.

http://sergentengineering.com

I saw these mentioned on Lance Mindheim's website and they are also on the Proto-87 site.  They were also covered in the "First Look" of the July, 2009 issue of MRH (I do not know how to put in the link to this article and its related comments, but you could go up to the above search box) Maybe one of the other members can put in this link.   I am planning a shelf layout (2 ft deep or less) as well and did not like the idea of under rail magnets either.

Anyway, just another idea.

Link for MRH video of Sergent Uncoupler, et al

Here is the link to the video:

http://vps880.inmotionhosting.com/~modelt5/assets/media/mrh3-std/Sergent-Couplers-Demo.php

Regarding remote magnetic

Regarding remote magnetic uncoupling, I am "dreaming" of a design - no guarantee it will gel - of an under track device that can be actuated similar to cable operated turnouts and uses cylindrical "rare earth" (neodymium) magnets. This design should function for both N scale and HO scale applications with appropriate sizing of mounting and rail separation. I do not know if it would function with the Sergent design, but I intend to have it work with the MTL (previously the Kadee N Scale Magne-matic) design.

Any ideas?

I have only a single spur on

Alan,

You most likely won't need an electromagnet uncoupling ramp for the location you show. It's not on a through track. Because trains aren't traveling by the major frustration of false uncoupling isn't going to be there.

But, I think you may have some problems with a magnet at that location. It may prove too near the curve which will result in trying to uncouple when couplers are pulled to the side by the offset of the car end on the curve. To be absolutely safe in this regard, the magnet needs to be a car length from the curve. However in practice 1/2 car length is often good enough. I'd suggest mocking up a section of track (to scale!) with a magnet in the appointed location and see how reliably cars uncouple there.

Alternatively, you might consider reaching in with an uncoupling pick (skewer), uncoupling on the straight back track, holding the knuckles in delayed uncoupling position, then shoving the car in question to it's spot. Not a perfect solution but the back track to the right of the proposed magnet location looks like easier access than the spur track itself.

Question: Is the spur track so far from the aisle that you can't reach it for rerailing or persuasion of balking couplers? If so you may want to rethink that location.

Best regards,

Charlie

Sufficient Tangent Track

Charlie,

Thanks for the advice. XTrkCAD shows I have sufficient tangent track to get the job done although I certainly will test before caulking down track as you suggest. The left end of the car is positioned where the curve begins. The reach is pretty close to 24". Problems at the industry may require a bit more imagination to reach. Fortunately this is my only long reach spur.

uncoupling magnets

Hi: Just in case you missed it, this is my post from a previous discussion about  uncoupling magnets.   Bruce

Uncoupling magnets

Magnetic uncoupler

I seem to remember an article somewhere where a guy used regular magnets mounted on a hinge under the layout that could be "engaged" or "disengaged" by a pull cable mounted in the fascia.  With the magnet "disengaged" it was dropped down away from the track, thus not affecting any couplers and eliminating false uncoupling.  When he wanted to uncouple a car he would pull on the knob in the fascia thus raising up the magnet into the track area where he could then position the cars to uncouple.  Sorry I can't remember where I saw this.

Rick