Joe Circus

The closet expansion has finally begun! The benchmark is complete, the sky boards are painted blue and will have  clouds added this weekend. They are about 20” above the foam base. It’s HO scale.

It’s 2 feet deep and about 10 feet wide ( long ) and will basically be a yard with background buildings along the 10 foot closet wall. I will attempt to shadow box this area as a trial run for the rest of the layout.

My question to you is this:

I have 11 or 12 background buildings to put in this area, would you have them touch, or would you leave space between them for gravel road access, or leave open space for whatever reason?

I am likely to put background flats behind the buildings for the illusion of more depth. When you use background flats behind plastic structures do you use HO scale or N scale?

edited for spelling and punctuation 

3ec6d8d.jpeg 

Moderator: added attached photos in-line. Click on them for full-size version. 

Reply 0
RMeyer

It would depend on the buildings

If the buildings are showing their front then you should have a road for access. If they are showing a loading platform or loading doors then they need to be near the tracks. If they are showing their back without RR access then you could have a little space with a fence between tracks and building.

Reply 0
ctxmf74

would you have them touch?

It depends on the scene I'm trying to create. Is it a busy city area where the buildings would be built touching or is it a rural scene where they had room to space the buildings, or is it something in between like a suburb location?  As for the use of N scale background buildings it might look okay if they are not placed right against the larger HO scale buildings but something like 80% of HO might look better if you are scratch building them. I have a scene on my layout with an HO scale 87:1 bridge in the background about 3 feet from my S scale 64:1 winery building and it looks okay. I suggest standing in your layout aisle, viewing the area from your operating position and arrange some cardboard building mock ups in different pattern till you find something that works for you....DaveB

Reply 0
fritzg

Very similar layout concept

Hi there...thought I would throw my 2 cents your way...

I am also running a switching HO layout - two moduless on industrial strength roll around shelving in the shape of an 'L'...one is 3 feet deep, and one is 20" deep...both are 8 feet long - but that makes the 20" deep module 11 feet long. (the 'L')

OK so now after all that.. the buildings for most of the businesses are on the 3 foot deep module....I chose to space my buildings after the move to North Las Vegas 8 months ago.  Before I had a few butted against one another but that was because I was trying to (force) get more buildings on the layout which in the long run I just didn't need.

HOside3.jpg 

top picture shows the separation of buildings which is currently how it will stay...bottom is before the move after the layout was "complete" (they never are face it)...and running switchers. Pictures show at least three buildings side by side

IMG_1650.JPG 

IMG_1649.JPG 

Separation allows you to insert roads and accesses to the businesses to fill out the scene:

Business.jpg 

ckWHouse.jpg 

And then when I have open back ground I use building flats I create from leftover parts and sides of buildings I did not complete building.  Like above.

I know some folks use N scale to depict distance for the back ground - but you have to consider, how much distance would you really see depending on the height of the view.  my layout is at a comfortable height for me which is almost street level.  56" actually above the floor.

I am still working of the back drop on the lengths of both modules, so there is a lot of work to be done.

Hope that helps

 

 

fritzg

WESTERN PACIFIC - San Francisco Car Float 1955-57
Two 8 foot modules in "L" : 30" and 20" depth

Reply 0
Joe Circus

Pix in the first post.

It seems I didn’t post the pics correctly on the first post. Maybe an admin can give me an assist. There are two pictures showing the buildings I’ve already built to go along the back wall behind the yard which will be on the viewer side.

most if not all of the buildings have loading docks/loading doors.

Reply 0
RSeiler

Pic...

Here you go: 

3ec6d8d.jpeg 

 

Randy

Randy

Cincinnati West -  B&O/PC  Summer 1975

http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/17997

Reply 0
Joe Circus

Thanks Randy!

That’s the second pic, the right side. Does the first pic work?

Apparently I uploaded the 2nd pic twice, that may teach me to do this on my phone.

4DBB9B1.jpeg 

Reply 0
Marc

Negative space scenery

.

There is another topic open now about negative space scenery. 

https://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/taxonomy/term/7

The concept to let some open space between building or between scene by making open scenery or any kind of opening which cut away the overwhelmed  scene we often produce.

Yes one of the  factor of the overwhelmed scene is space, by the way we need to use any square inch to put models or trains.

Back to this topic, for sure along a yard many real building are all against each other, but....

If you look carefully on old pictures you will quickly notice a big amount of open space resumed by streets or small open surface or even demolished buildings.

Here you can find numerous pictures of "wall yard building"  with open space    www.shorpy.com

It's not very difficult to model such scene and the opening could be also kind of vista of further or behind country giving the illusion the open space exist behind the wall of building .

Isolate each building from each other give a kind of patchwork not realistic, but blocs of a few building separate by some open space or vista is really natural.

The famous trick of John Allen with the use of mirrors is particularly appropriate in this case, like a tunnel or a bridge with a street which connect the front scene to the back scene.

Vegetation is also important in such scene and also help to make open space or something different in the wall of building.

So a full wall of building seems to me overwhelming and behind to be convincing , even if it's seems impressive.

 

On the run whith my Maclau River RR in Nscale

Reply 0
Joe Circus

My original notion

was to leave some space between several groups of buildings. Then two things happened;

I started shopping "picture" background buildings, and they were often "touching".

I ended up with to more buildings and felt the urge to "cram" them all in, as they have no other place on the layout, only in this 10 foot section.

I leaning back to leaving some space, we'll see what appears in those spaces.

More examples of what you've done is appreciated.

Reply 1
Joe Circus
The yard is operational as of today.

I'll post the track plan and some pix tomorrow.
Reply 1
Joe Circus
9680386E-BBA0-4943-87A4-527964D8A8D7.jpeg
This is pretty close to how it sits ATM. This is just a pic of my SCARM screen, You'll note that I don't have an accurate representation of the 15" radius 1/2 curves. And, the four yard tracks don't appear to touch, ignore those things please, it's virtually all flex track and everything connects, and runs without a hitch.

I had originally "borrowed" the track plan from Ron's Trains and Things on You Tube, but decided to attempt to move away from a stub yard.

I'm happy, but wouldn't mind hearing your input.

ETA; I'll attempt to add the structures to the "plan" tonight.
Reply 0
Dan Pugatch Breakwater Branch
I think it comes down to what do you like to look at? Lance Mindheim's approach is less buildings and more spread out which works for suburban industrial freight.

While I do own all his books and agree with his track planning approaches, the sparse approach to structures and scenery is not my style. I've lived in New England my whole life and mostly in major cities. I am urban modeler with all the buildings crammed in only leaving room for narrow roads and alleyways.  More street running track than ballast.

When it comes to my layout I get my most enjoyment from building the structures. An analog version of Sim City perhaps? George Sellios is my biggest influence and I prefer his method of squeezing everything  in and and then adding even more.

So if I was building your layout, I would use buildings to fill the majority of the backdrop. Note these are not rail served unless one is a centerpieces structure say a large industry that takes up a significant chunk of space. I would use a mixture of flats, buildings that only stick out an inch or two, DPM modules and ITLA modules to make custom industries, and kitbash or scratchbuild to make angular buildings.

By having your roads hit the backdrop at an angle and even disappear behind taller buildings you will create the illusion of more. 

If you are going to use a photo backdrop of buildings make sure there's Force perspective and that they are at an angle and smaller than the kits you built.

This is all what I'm planning to do with my small layout. (11ft x 3ft  x 20" deep in L shape). I am doing a harbor with a city. The longer part of the L  (8ft x 20") will be the city. The smaller part (3ft x 20") will be the waterfront.

That's my 34 cents!
Freelance HO Scale set in 1977-1984 Portland, Maine.
Reply 0
Joe Circus
I thought I was the only one that liked "busy". AKA crammed full...

I think there are 17 buildings in the 2' by 10' 4" space.
Reply 0
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