Choices

There are few model engines that run as smoothly and quietly and pull as well as the Atlas GP7 and its RS1 cousin. You can expect a higher level of detail on the Athearn Genesis body -- so my pick is the Athearn shell and the Atlas drive.

Personally

If I were to choose between the two,  I would choose the Atlas models because I find there details to be a bit more robust than the Athearn ones.  Also with Athearn, contrary to what has been reported, they are still shipping most of thier models with those miserable 1.5V micro bulbs that most of the time don't even last a full circuit around the layout.  Seeing as you will need to do a full disassembly to paint, if you go with the Athearn model, now would be the time to replace the bulbs with LEDs.  The Athearn Tsunami decoders are set from the factory to use the 1.5v bulbs as the resistors are built into the board, so you will need to find the 14v+ solder pin/hole and solder in your blue wire then you can use the correct resistors for the LEDs.

Mopac Geep 7's

I purchased an Athearn GP7

I purchased an Athearn GP7 about 18 months ago. Earlier run with sound. Loved the engine till I tried to pull cars with it. The engine was extremely light and IIRC would only pull about 6-8 cars up a 1.75% grade. Ended up taking the engine back and swapping it out for a totally different engine. Not saying the newer ones would be the same but keep the receipt.

Love the detail on both and as for quality of product goes I don't think you will go wrong on either. 

Atlas

don't have a GP7 by either manufacturer.  I do have extensive performance data from both makers models.  Genesis has a lot of variation.  Both inside a give model type and from model to model.  Atlas is much less inside a given model type.  However, when looking at different models or releases, the variation is larger.  They seem to change motors more frequently than Athearn. So that may be part of it.

the Genesis torque per pound of engine weight is as good as any, better than Atlas.  The issue is that the Genesis models I have measured are lighter than the Atlas models.  Because of that, Atlas will pull longer trains.

realizing the variation differences, they are both very good performing models.  The final selection will likely be based on features that fit your preference.

I once had two yellow box

I once had two yellow box Atlas GP7's in D&RGW orange but the paint job on them was 3rd rate - they were supposed to be black but they looked dark gray, and the orange paint looked more reddish and wasn't very sharp.  They ran well as they had KATO drives but ultimately I wasn't happy with the looks and the metal frame that you couldn't detail very easily and the paint chipped off of it just by handling it.

Atlas did finally offer D&RGW in the improved "classic" GP7 but they never offered any versions that the D&RGW kept beyond 1972 so I waited until Athearn Genesis offered their GP9 which look much better and run just as well.

I think both are good options and it depends on what RR you need them for and who offers the right paint scheme.  If none of that matters, then I'm sure either would do well.

Thanks

I appreciate the feedback everyone, it is very helpful.  What I am hearing here and researching the web is almost consistent positive feedback for Atlas Locomotives but reviews of Athearn Genesis locomotives is mixed.  

Certainly not trashing Athearn locomotives.  I am very pleased with the Genesis GP38 and GP50 units I have and the detail is incredible.   However, the main reason of these purchases was the availability of MOPAC models not a specific like of the Athearn brand.  

Given I will be starting with an undecorated model and the fact that either is not cheap, I wanted to do more extensive research.  

So as it stands now, I am going to wait for the Atlas release this month. "Hopefully" a vendor out there purchased a few undecorated Atlas models that have not been spoken for.  

Joe

Probably....

Probably the right move Joe! I have both the latest Atlas H16-44 and an Athearn Genesis GP9. The latter is a beautiful looking model, but is so light compared to the Atlas loco's, and therefore finds the slightest imperfections in my track, and the sound momentarily cuts out. Just hoping that Atlas will bring out a GP7 in a suitable livery....

@ Brian

Brian,

I have experienced the same issue on turnouts with my Athearn's from time to time and always assumed it was the "classic" short wheelbase, dirty rail, etc.

Never considered the weight as a possible issue.  It will be interesting to see if the problem goes away with the Atlas.

Joe

Vote for Atlas

Joe....Having JUST bought my 1st Atlas locomotive ( SP Black Widow RS 11 ) there is NO comparison of the quality compared to Genesis. Sound is MUCH better, quality is superior, and what it lacks in detail is minimal. The last Genesis locomotive I purchased ( SP Black Widow GP 9 ) had loose handrails, muted sound, and the rear trucks would not pick up power. After the 2 hour repairing to fix everything, I am disappointed. HOWEVER, it is very pretty for a brick. Now if you want to talk about Bowser....I quickly jumped on that bandwagon...going from none to 3 ASAP !

Michael

SP Black Widow RS 11

What is it with that engine ?? It seems a lot of folks really like that engine (I am including myself). I don't know what it is but it seems to be very popular indeed.

Weighty Matters

When I experience this problem with Athearn locos, it's nearly always caused by poor electrical connections.  

The wires are too often improperly stripped and/or badly connected with the plastic clips.  Re-stripping the wire and soldering the joints usually eliminates the problem.

In other cases, at least with the older style trucks used in most Athearn RTR units, there's paint buildup around the axle slots so the bearings can't make good electrical contact with the bearing plates.  Scrape the gunk around the slots and ensure any residue is cleaned from the bronze bearings.

Atlas locos can be heavier, but from my experience they also usually have wiring that's assembled better.

I like the Atlas locomotives.

I like the Atlas locomotives. All of the locomotives I have from them have been great. I have had to tune some of them to get them to run well, but after that they pull well and run great. I have the H16- 44, RS 11, RS1, GP-7, H24-66 and SD24. I have multiples of these models and have been pleased with them. My latest purchase was one of the H16-44 models with the lok sound decoder. I gave it a test run and it seems to be another great runner.

As to pulling power I have pulled a train of 187 cars with the following three locomotives, H24-66, H24-66, H16-44. The train easily went up a 2 % grade about  a scale 3/4 of a mile in length. Some of the cars in that train were not very free rolling as we grabbed every car on the club layout in addition to my cars and my friend Paul's who was there at the time.

The first video on my blog shows a train of 160 cars being pulled by the three locomotives above.

Joe....Having JUST bought my

It sounds like the sound feature, from what you're saying above, factored in a big way your decision to go with Atlas.  I don't choose to buy my engines based on sound but I have to say, I have been disappointed with Athearns choice to go with the Tsunami, which is inferior in many ways to the ESU Loksound.  Because of that I chose to buy my 2 Genesis GP9's without sound, as well as most of my other Athearn loco's.  Sound has never been a reason for me to not buy Athearn however.

Of course Atlas does not offer GP9's at all, so for me and the time period I model, for the GP9, Genesis was really the only clear option these days and mine have been quite nice and I am not disappointed.

It also sounds like you had a bad model with your Genesis GP9 - which btw is not a GP7 and is not a reason to write off the entire product line - lets be fair.

I have a question about construction of the Atlas GP7.  My old Atlas GP7's I sold off had a metal frame that went right up to the walkway level.  The upside to so much of the chassis and lower body being metal is weight.  The down side, especially if you are painting and detailing your own, is it would probably be difficult drilling tiny holes in really hard metal.  Are the current crop of Atlas GP7's still using the same chassis as the old ones? 

Very little difference between GP7 and GP9

Most of the changes were internal from the GP7 to the GP9 as in a 250 HP increase from 1500 to 1750 HP.

Unless you are counting every rivet, nut, bolt, door latch, ect. Both can be used interchangeably as either a GP7 or a GP9. 

Unless you are counting every

I don't count rivets, nuts, bolts or door latches thank you.  I dont' agree and I think the reasons are not trivial.  There are more visible difference and yes it matters to a lot of people.   One thing i like about the Genesis models is usually they are set up to copy some of the differences seen on the models used by that RR in question.  For example, D&RGW GP7's had 36" DB fans, while the GP9's had 48" DB fans.  The first 4 GP7's purchased by the D&RGW were delivered with the smaller fuel tank and had no viewing slots in the side skirts - try cutting those into the metal sides in the Atlas chassis - very difficult I would imagine.  The Atlas GP7 only appears to come in one basic body style and with 36" DB fan or no DB, and no slots in the side skirt.  So the variations are limited.  GP9's had a variety of fan configurations on the roof including 48" DB and either singles or duels on either side or the DB fan hatch.  Yes, it matters to some.

It's more than just rivets, nuts, bolts, door latches and louvers.  Sure, if a modeler can't tell the difference between a GP7 and GP9 or an F3, F7, F9 etc. than sure, it shouldn't matter, be fair to the rest.

Thanks, Jim Fitch 

I'll take...

I'll take an Atlas loco any day over an Athearn one. They track better, they don't have electrical pickup issues like my GP9B does, the Atlas handrails aren't bent up, and the Loksound is 10 x better

You missed the point Jim.

It was not meant as a derogatory statement.  It was simply meant as an overall view of the same two models to most people (not modelers) would never know the difference.  Heck I don't even know most of the differences nor do I care.  I just want them to run well.  The last Athearn Genesis I purchased was this unit.  Had to completely rebuild the running gear and improve all the electrical system just to get it to go down the track more than 3 feet!  Handrails, although the look good at first are extremely flimsy and those miserable 1.5V micro bulbs burned out within 3 days of my running it on my layout!  Not what I expect for $289.00 of hard earned money!  

Nelson, I didn't miss the

Nelson, I don't agree.  I acknowledge your point that for some people, who can't tell the difference, then a GP7 and a GP9 basically won't matter.  BTW, I didn't personally take your comment as derogatory, but some might as the it refers to counting rivets - and many of us in the hobby have heard the term "rivet counter" for many years and it almost always has a negative connotation; although I can't blame you if you didn't know that.  Apologies.  But I don't want that to overshadow the point I wanted to make to readers here, in general, is that to many hobbyists, a GP7 is definitely not a GP9.  I don't know if the original poster cares or not but just in case he does, it's a point to consider before buying and not after.

I am sorry for your experience.  Personally if I spent $289 and I wasn't happy, I'd return the model for a refund or exchange it for a good one.  For that much, you should get a product your satisfied with IMO.

Meanwhile back at the Bat

Meanwhile back at the Bat Cave, Batman prefers Atlas. He likes them much better, esp with Loksound. He has much experience with both and it is his Personal Preference.  Kinda like choosy mothers choose Jif. 

Batman knows he can add or subtract details if need be with the help of the Bat Computer. Ohh.. He just told me he has had less issues with Atlas over newer Athearn.

Batmans friend Superman recently returned 2 new Genesis locos to Athearn because they lost motor control. His super hearing has heard of the problem from others as well.  

So there you have it .. 

Jim and Joe and all the others...

Jim, funny you should mention that...in fact I did buy it unheard and unrun. I LOOKED at it before purchasing it, and noted that it did have a LokSound decoder. My Black Widow / Alco side of my brain kicked in and that was that. My only run in with LokSound was with my previously unknown Bowser VO 1000's, which I also love dearly. It is interesting that I struggled with Athearn for YEARS, tinkering with this, fixing that, yet remained loyal to them. Never considered Atlas or Bowser ( stupid me ) because I am a lone wolf, and just did not know any better. I am sure if I had belonged to a club I would have heard comments about other manufacturers, and other DCC decoders. Yes, I saw the reviews and watched the video's, but there is just something about really seeing and hearing, operating and listening, to a locomotive that makes my decisions. THAT said, since I have joined MRH, and read and watched ALL of YOU excellent modelers, I have begun to learn that I can respect your opinions, both positive and negative, and make both my purchases, and modeling techniques, better.

Also, my main emphasis is steam, with freight being the general focus on the Moosehead. So BLI is my friend big time, and I have had 0 issues with operation OR sound with any of them. My buddy Paul is big time into BIG modern diesels ( AC 6000 - SD 70 etc. ) and I absolutely love what BLI is doing with sound in those. However, WAY out of my era, and I never designed the Moosehead to run 6 axle diesels...even thou they do run very well on my tight trackwork.

As the old saying goes...I should get out more !

Michael

p.s. Now to try those new sugar cubes speakers you all are raving about !

My take

Here is my take on it.  If you can find a yellow box Atlas-Kato GP7, snap it up, strip it, and paint as desired, if you can live with the detail level on the cast metal frame.  I purchased one, added a decoder, and it pretty much became my best running engine with no work done to it. 

Not having one the China built Atlas GP7s, I am unfamiliar with their running qualities, or what has changed as far as shell detail.  If they kept the massive cast frame, removing some weight for speaker installation wouldn't have much effect.  Might not have to remove any, if using iPhone speakers or similar.

Any particular reason why P2K isn't in your choices?  They also run well, or the Kato drive can the retrofitted for better running, and good shell detail.

Mike, good question.  The

Mike, good question.  The older LL P2K do seem to be available on Ebay mostly ranging from $60 to over $100.- it would be up to the modeler how much remediation they would want to do.  I'm guessing these would need all the axles replaced, and possibly the whole drive. While some do report they run decent, IIRC, Joe here has talked about the mechanism doesn't hold up long term.  IIRC Wathers produces upgraded versions now also.

I also like the Atlas

I also like the Atlas engines. Details can be added fairly easily for some things. The louvers not so easily and fans are a bit of work to change. Since I free-lance having an exact model of a specific prototype is not the most important thing on the list. Having a good strong pulling drive is. I have had to tune up most of my locomotives but it is not a hard thing to do. I really like the Atlas locomotives.

I have also run others and been pleased with them but the Atlas are my favorite models.