Amen, my friend!

Amen, my friend!

"Had I simply held my tongue"

   Then you'd be feeling like you let the jerk have his own way. At least you got to tell him that  he's full of crap so he knows it and the people caught in the crossfire know it, and who knows maybe one of them will confront him one of these days? .....DaveB

Well said, Ken

We are all guilty of it at one time or another, but its something we need to be vigilant with in all we do, whether at work, home or on a model railroad forum.  

So True

So true, Ken, good questions to ask oneself.

What do you suggest...

...when one's (or a group with which you belong to or associate with) integrity and honor is being fouled?  How can one be expected to hold their tongue?  In some cultures, when that occurs, physical confrontation is required.  Now I am not suggesting that be done, but at the very least a refutation of an accusation should be at the very least acceptable.

Ken L.

Politicians Need Not Post

That's a tough one Ken. Without knowing everything how does one know the answer to this question?

This one shoots down all the atta boy responses. Granted they are nice to read if it is a response to your own work but you have to admit they don't meet your qualifier.

Totally agree. These posts we can do without. If any of mine have come across this way I apologize. They were not meant to be inflammatory. Debates with well reasoned arguments are great learning experiences. Flame wars are a waste of everyone's time.

Message Search is your friend...

Dear Alan,

Simple solution, Message Search is your friend...

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

PS I have to admit I get a bit of a bee in my bonnet when a question post starts with something like
"...I couldn't be bothered to check for myself, so can someone hand me the answer,
perfectly tuned for my particular circumstance, on a silver platter?..."...

but I'm still going to heed Ken R's guides (which for my mind sound like straight-up common courtesy anyway), 
and try to helpfully, positively, and politely answer the question to assist my fellow modellers none-the-less...

A couple answers

I shouldn't say that my list is a strict set of rules, but rather a sort of mental guideline.  Still, I think that at atta-boy is at least mildly useful, since it encourages a fellow modeler to share.  And honestly, I don't think there is ever an time when "Thank You" is inappropriate or unwelcome.

If you can answer the offender in an honest way, and disprove whatever is being claimed about you, then I don't see a reason why it would be wrong - provided that doing so would actually improve the situation.  It seems to me that most arguments are a waste of time, though, since the parties usually end up back in their own corners, just a little more mad at the other side.  A public debate, or an honest and open conversation, is a different matter entirely.  In that case, it is educational, since there is an opportunity to teach and to learn about a position, opinion, or fact.

Remember, though - this is just my opinion.  I do not claim to have THE ANSWER, even if there was such a thing.  I was just thinking about a few of the times when I have upset people, here or elsewhere, and I wish I could have handled the situations better.  I figured I would express my opinion, in the hopes that someone else might see this and think "Hey, I know what he means, maybe I'll try that too."  If that happens, maybe our world will be just a tiny bit nicer.  Or maybe I'm wrong - it's happened a couple times!

Why rebuttals often don't work

Wrong.

If someone is wrong, and you know it, then you should point it out -- otherwise how would they ever know?  This also serves to minimize the continued propagation of bad advice, so common on the Internet.  If comments on this (or any other forum) "break a friendship" ... then I'd suggest the 'friendship" was never there -- so no worries.

Yes, sometimes things escalate, and when they do, you just keep hammering back until you've beaten some sense into their hard head or a mod steps in and cools things off (that is what mods do).  Nothing to get the blood boiling quite like a good old fashioned shouting match over the Internet.

The best targets are the Cybernet Bullies (but they are nearly impossible to shut down until a mod steps in and locks the thread ... after which you need to find a new sandbox to play in).  Those brainless 'know-it-alls' who pop into a conversation/thread with some idiotic idea or other useless information are another high value target; deserving of the "full monty" as well.

erm .... thought I had something more to say ....

Recognize the limitations of forums

The written word alone is very one dimensional.  Without the accompanying body language, tone of voice, etc. a message can sound very harsh, dismissive, insulting, etc.  This confusion when you were really trying to inject some humor, ask a question, or just respond in a mild kind of way can lead to flame wars.

I read what I have written and try to think about it from the point of view of someone who doesn't know me and can't see or hear me.  I also try to be careful about humor since I've had this back fire on me.

Lastly, I don't get offended.  I try to give the other person the benefit of the doubt.  He has the same limitations on his message that I have on mine.

Enjoy

Paul

The Bullies & Know-it-Alls

Dave,

In a way I sort of have to agree with you on that account. I've discovered if you ask the Know-it-All to prove what they are saying you can usually shut them down in a hurry. With the Bully I play the Mohamed Ali "rope a dope". They get tired after a while and even more frustrated, then I hit them with a punch.

Darn, now I gave away my secrets. I'll never get away with another "discussion" here on MRH.   

Bernd

P.S. Note the simile's and wink?

What Joe said - and I

I hesitate to post but...

I'll say this one thing.... if someone disagrees with you over the way you do something or your way of pursuing a goal then generally speaking, it's not personal.  It's just that they have a different view.  That simple and nothing more. This business of "fouling someone's integrity and honor" makes me laugh.  How do you do that on an internet forum?  Because you disagree with someone or object to the tone of their post or their writing or what it may imply to you?  There are way too many thin skinned people in this world. Granted, sometimes things get out of hand, we are all human after all and sometimes our emotions get the best of us and we write or say something that was better left  unsaid but for the most part even somewhat heated disagreements never get to that point.  Relax and if you disagree with someone, state your case of why you disagree and then move on.  Don't take things so personally that next time the person who you had the disagreement with post needing help with something you may know the answer too that you ignore their post or otherwise refuse to talk to them.  That's just being childish.

I'm out..... peace and goodwill to all, even the folks I sometimes disagree with,

Michael

If you see a mistake

Eric H #9 Armchairs

"Why is everybody always picking on me?"   from an old 1950s song.

Armchair    http://armchairmodelbuilders101.com    

Really?

Rick:

Where would the unwashed find this Contact function? 

I see plenty of Contact Us links to get to the MRH staff, but no contact function to other subscribers.

Click on the person's ID attached to the message

This will bring up the person's public profile and there's a 'Contact' button to the upper right.

Mike

Aha!

Thanks Mike.

Can we learn from someone's duplicate post?

I think so.  Most have a different slant in their slant on a solution.  Synergy means working together and doing a little brainstorming.  If I can learn from someone else then I have gained knowledge that I didn't have or maybe even had a different answer.

Admittedly there are people who post just to post.  Can we learn from them?  We should be able to if we have an open mind.

My two cents.

"or a mod steps in and cools things off"

    The mods annoy me more than the rowdy posters. It's stupid to lock a thread and punish everyone just because one or two guys have problems with the subject. Much better to just give the trouble makers a time out and let everyone else continue the conversation.....DaveBranum

Why?

Why do people get so wound up and need to heard and then to be confirmed in front of a group as being "right" or even worse "righteous"?

I spent some time on various forums, one running related, a few high end audio related, a few modeling forums and one for mixed martial arts. Contrary to popular belief, the latter one is the least combative, just guys ribbing each other a bit for fun.

In various other places, things end up in name calling, putting someone's knowledge in doubt etc. Just downright insecure display and flexing of muscles....

It makes me want to switch off the PC and live in a cabin in the Cascades, far away from this thing called "the internet".

If I see conflict in real life or the internet, I often walk away as most matters are simply too small to be concerned with.. Just relax, it's just bytes in the ether.

Don' you think most know it?

Ignoring them ...

... if only it were so easy ....