Turnouts

I just read the last post in your freight yard thread about damaged turnouts. Looking at the photos my thought is that maybe it is caused by sitting in the sun in a window? Depending on climate and house orientation and length of time the sun comes through a window, things can get pretty hot.

Anyway I wish you luck on fixing this. No ideas on how to go about it though.

Jack

Repair Idea?

Jack that's a likely cause.

Here are a few of my initial thoughts. I figure I need a little heat to the ties, then some constant, very flat pressure. I was thinking a hot water bath might soften up the ties just enough without deforming any individual one, then a good flat board clamped over the top of the rails for an hour or so?

Perhaps I should run a sanding block over the underside just enough to take off the outer edge tips of the ties that appear to have a little curl to them??

Anyone ever submerged a turnout in hot water??

The torture will continue....ha...ha

water

No, Brian. I have never put a turnout under water. BUT: The material is plastic and nickel silver. What can happen? Did you figure these as possible throwaways? If so, go ahead and soak them? What have you got to lose? This is a very interesting situation/problem you have. Worth experimenting. You obviously won't want to boil the water. Plastic has the potential to melt. But hot water should not melt PECO ties. You might wish to contact PECO and ask them how hot the water can be. (At one time, I had contacted them about the difference between the plastic on the flex vs the turnouts. The plastic is a different material. They never did say why.) I'd suggest you start with soaking for 2 hours. See if they soften. If not, try longer. Sanding or whatever on the bottom is definitely necessary. The bottom must be smooth. Do not put them in an oven. That could be disastrous. As for how long to leave flat with weights on - that should be for a very long time. I'd leave them overnight. Hope this helps. And thanks for bringing this up - I for one am interested in what you find out. "Don't forget to use the NMRA gauge to test".

Uncurling your turnout

Here's what I would try. I took a look on the link you provided. Since they are not nailed/glued down to the table top this method I'm suggesting my work.

Lay the turnout track side down on a flat surface. Apply heat using a hair dryer. If the heat is not enough from the hair dryer used a heat gun, but start from a greater distance from the plastic. You just want to heat them, not melt them. Once the plastic is "hot to the touch" place a heavy weight on the ties. Wait till the plastic cools and then take a look. 

If my method ruins the turnout I'll pay for a new one. 

Bernd

Track ... replace bad track, do not repair it

Hmmm!

JoeF. I agree - except for: the price of turnouts these days. If Brian wants to play with fixing his, I say "let him". But you are totally correct in that 99% of track problems are turnouts. And in Brian's case, it depends on where he's going to install them. If they are on front tracks, easily worked on, he can at least try to salvage them. It sure won't cost him much if they can be salvaged. The last time I priced PECO, they are close to $30 at discount. Over $37 at a LHS.

Relay Them

Narrow Gauge and Short line Gazette has an article on converting Atlas turnouts to On30. That means mostly getting rid of the original ties and replacing them with On30 ties.

No reason the same can't be done with these. The author used some PC ties and wood for everything else.

Might be worth buying the issue or looking up some turnout hand laying articles and or videos.

If you do want to try the heat method make sure whatever you lay them on is really flat like maybe a sheet of glass.

Jack

It ain’t no fun

Sure, they’re not cheap. But it ain’t no fun if the trains don’t run (well).

Bottom line, how much is getting great performance worth? $60-$74 to get much better performance on your layout could be a bargain. Pennywise and pound foolish comes to mind.

Sure, Brian is welcome to try fixing bad turnouts. But in my experience, it’s a lot of work and the results will be iffy at best. Trying to fix a bad commercial turnout is actually more work than just building a brand new turnout using my poor man’s jig methods, or using a Fast Tracks jig. And the results will be a lot more satisfying.

So I just don’t waste my time now. I just build a replacement for about $10 in materials and about an hour of my time. And the final result is guaranteed to be a great performing turnout. The fixing a bad turnout task will be more effort and it’s iffy at best. You may just get a turnout that still doesn’t work right, only in a different way.

Experiment

As I believe I have indicated, I consider these old ones throw away, BUT I want to experiment.

In place of hot water I though I would start out using our Florida sunshine. Jack's comment prompted this when he mentioned that it might have been the reason they deformed in the first place,'sitting in a window' somewhere.

So I set them plastic-ties-up out in my driveway for about an hour today, then clamped them down between two pieces of 3/4" plywood with a strong screw C clamp. I'm going to leave them clamped overnight. We will see what tomorrow brings?

My second experiment may be with a hot air gun. I have a good one.

I only left them in the sunshine for a little over an hour, as about a year ago I sought to straighten out some plastic parts belonging to my previously used roundhouse. The doors of that roundhouse warped too much,...beyond usability,..lesson learned. Florida sunshine can be HOT....ha...ha

trade offer

BTW I placed a wanted ad on the yard sale forum for 2  small radius turnouts. And I offered to trade some electrofrog turnouts in larger sizes for these 2 small ones,...kind of figured most modern folks would be looking for bigger radi turnouts, and electrofrog ones at that.

JoeF. I agree - except for:

IIRC, the Peco of referencce here are code 100 and Kleins prices them at $21.99..Sure they've gone up a buck or two, but not $30 or more.  Code 83 Peco are higher priced.  I got most of mine for anywhere fromj $23 to $26 and $29 ish for the #8 and curved. 

Jim

Some places they have. LHS has them at $42.95. MSRP is $32. Midwest Hobby has them at $21-24 depending.

When I brought the price up to the manager one day and asked why they were $20.00 over the internet price I got a blank look. I'm pretty careful about what I buy there.

Jack

Jack

Jack,  Right.  But not to be cheeky but what do high priced turnouts have to do with this discussion?  They are irrelevant if I can find vendors to buy them for decent discount prices.  And there are plenty of them out there.

That manager who had the turnouts priced at $20 over internet or discount prices sounds like a shop manager who will be going out of business for lack of business savvy.  Most people are used to hunting for better prices for food, gas, other products.  Same with model train products; we shop around and find vendors with good reliable service and decent discount prices.  Common sense stuff I would hope.

Encouraged

I removed the clamps from my 2 turnouts this morning and noticed a definite improvement in their 'flatness'. I believe I could have utilized a bit more heat. So today I will run a sanding block over the backside to ensure the outer tips of the ties are even,...then I will experiment with the heat gun to get a little more heat.

All in all, looks promising.

My repair tools for these 2

3 Way Repair I mentioned

3 Way Repair

I mentioned having repaired a 3-way Peco I received in the mail that had been bent in its mailing wrap. Here are some photos of that turnout before I began the reconditioning.

as it arrived
 

where it got bent in the mail
 

Would you believe I got this turnout straighten out??.....with a big hammer, some flat pieces of strong 3/4 plywood, and some reverse bending. It looks as good as new now, and it operates just fine.

Perhaps I should have been an auto body shop professional? ( I tried repairing several cars of my own when I was younger,...all unacceptable....ha...ha)

Thank You, Brian

You are doing what I would do. Make a reasonable attempt to salvage a turnout. Yes, I referred to PECO code 83 turnouts for cost. Yes, the LHS do charge over MSRP. And the only reason I mentioned cost was because JoeF mentioned throwing the warped turnouts away and I thought that throwing a turnout away and buying a new one was not frugal. That's why I am on here now saying that I am proud of Brian for what he's doing. It's the MR spirit. When it ain't working, try to fix it. When you fail, that's when you throw it away. As for JoeF. I meant no offense. I am only commenting in Brian's thread. And there are instances where I would not hesitate to throw something away. But that's when it's unrepairable. I hope we are all still friends. One final comment: I'd use glass instead of wood to clamp down on the turnouts. Of course, in a FL sun, that glass would get too hot too. So maybe wood is your best choice.

Rule #1

SUCCESS !!

@ Pennsy_Nut
Now that you mention glass I do recall putting my roundhouse parts/doors under glass in the Florida sun. I left them there too long and the doors got warped.

I didn't get the turnouts hot enough using the Florida sun, but that heat gun this morning did the job !!

Check this transformation out,..
...original warp-age
 

...and now after my heat gun treatment...
 

I think they are usable,...and the track gauge has not changed,...and the frogs are no longer proud.
Plus these 2 turnouts are close enough to the edge of the aisle that they can be changed out if need be in the future. Hallelujah

UPDATE: If memory serves me correctly I did NOT check the track gauge of these 2 turnouts prior to my heat application. And when I checked it just recently I found that it had narrowed ever so little in a few spots thru the turnout. I don't know if this narrowing was caused by my heat application,...or already existed before when it was warped. I will say that is is so perceptibly small that I am going to continue my experiment with these two, while taking special note of any problems with this gauge problem.

Brian, photo editing

You might want to edit your photos and remove your address Brian.

Jus' sayin'

Joe

My address shows up on my

My address shows up on my photos??....don't understand, not computer savvy?

You took a photo of your

You took a photo of your address...its on the package you received your peco turnout in. 

We fixed it ... we pixelated the address for you

Way to go Brian

Maybe you can end the suspense and hook those turnouts to some flex track and give us a finial ? verdict.

Hoping anyway,   Jack

Will Test them out

Jack,.... I will hook those turnouts back into the spot I removed them from tomorrow, and give it a test.

If i can bring my memory back on board, I also want to try shimming those guard rails and frogs of the 2 Roco double curve turnouts. They haven't given me problems yet but I highly suspect they will.