First One

I will start off these reverse loop questions with one of the most obvious examples. Looking at the upper left hand corner we see the mainline making a flat loop inside the helix structure, then returning as the opposite mainline at point B. I had figured that I would make the entry point somewhere along the other mainline at point A. That should be plenty long enough for my longest train.

One question arises. What do I do about the siding turnout at X point that feeds the peninsula? It feeds that double slip turnout that feeds the peninsula, and if I'm correct that double slip must be fed by 2 identical polarities??

Second Reverse

I was next working on the siding on the right hand side of the room, and as I got up to the loop into the double slip I discovered this new problem,...I could end up with opposite polarities at point D & C,...at the double slip.
 

Compounding this situation is the freight yard ladder track, and coaling tower tracks that are connecting with the peninsula with the same polarities of those mainline tracks on the left side of the layout. I believe that all the tracks within my peninsula should be identical polarity??

2 sections plus?

Section A to B looks fine.Double gaps at A and at B where the return loop connects.

Put double gaps at X in the leg that goes to the peninsula.

Two main lines and all the peninsula and the track coming to peninsula from X and the entire slip switch all wired with this same polarity.

Second section: Double gap at D.Other double gap on the feeder track, near the turnout that feeds it.

QUESTION: There's a second track that heads for the peninsula shown at E. Do any tracks that it feeds connect to tracks coming from the freight yard side? If so that's another Reverse Section.

DOUBLE ENTRIES?

Are you likely to have trains entering Rev1 from B and X at the same time? Let's hope not. But if so, consider moving the double gap from B to the other leg of X.  Trains will collide before messing up the reverser's electronics.

DrJolS

@ DrJolS

So I have one reverse section from A to B.

Then I need a second reverse section from G to D.

Yes that other track from E to F does connect to tracks in the peninsula,  so because it is connected back into the mainlines it needs to be a reverse section as well?.....and all the siding tracks in the brick factory and waterfront scene in that corner should be wired to that buss?
Edited: I assume I don't need to be worried about the length of this reverse section, as I won't be running long trains in this section, nor trains with electrical pick-ups at their extremes?

That means I will have 3 different buss lines down that side of the room,....the double mainlines, then the 2 peninsula feeder tracks? I assume there is no way that both of these feeders tracks could be wired to the same reverser??

Double Entries

Thanks for that warning. I don't expect to be running 2 trains in that loop at any one time. Either a train will be just running thru that loop,...or there will be a train backed into the peninsula delivering goods to the peninsula tracks. I guess I need to be careful not to run another train into that loop while anything is going on with delivery or pickup from the peninsula.

E to F

Brian,

The question is whether peninsula tracks from E connect to tracks from the slip switch or from the freight yard. If so, there is a reversing section. Look at the polarity of E-F coming off the main line at F, and compare to polarity of the tracks from slip switch and from freight yard to verify.

If this happens, you need double gaps at F and somewhere close to E. Don't put the second gap where a second loco switching the peninsula can cross it while a first loco is crossing gap at F.

Yes, tracks to brick factory and waterfront are fed the same power polarity as track E to F.

Third reverse circuit is needed. You don't want trains to be traversing two reverse sections at the same time.

Your assumption about length of the section looks OK, provided you always follow your stated rules about make-up of trains.

DrJolS

Peninsula and Loop

The gap at X means that a loco in the peninsula has power separate from the loop. That loco can play in the peninsula with no effect on another train traversing the loop, except if it crosses the gap. The only concern I see is possible collision at the switch.

DrJolS

Here is that other loop track

Here is that other loop track exiting the peninsular area,...no direct connection to the double slip, but connected to all the other peninsula tracks.

Probable should put that other isolation joint where the arrow is in this first photo?

Peninsula and Loop

Brian,

Yes, your arrow points to a good spot for the gaps.

DrJolS

Terminology?

"Double gaps " can be confusing .Does it mean a gap in both rails at one spot or does it mean two sets of gaps a short distance apart( to create a non powered section longer than a wheel span) .....DaveB

YES.....

I see how two meanings are lurking in "double gaps." Every time I wrote that in this thread I meant one gap in each rail at one spot.

DrJolS

Power Disricts verses and/or Reverse Loops

I think I need to set down and reread this subject thread I started due to my new knowledge on the reverse loops offer by DrJolS. May have a substantial influence on how I define my Power Districts

Power Districts & Safety Curcuit Breakers
https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/power-districts-safety-curcuit-breakers-12216485

...tomorrow with a fresh mind

Reversing Sections can be Power Districts

Reversing Sections can be Power Districts

  "can't I just consider

you can but a reverse loop is usually not power hungry enough to need to be a power district. If it only requires a couple of feeder pair to get the power around it there's no real reason to make it a separate power district. That's why a sub bus with feeders or separate feeders run from  an auto reverser is often recommended....DaveB

Sub Buss

But how do you wire a sub-buss if  'no buss wires are to be connected between the reverse section and another section' ? (did I say the correctly?)

Let me clarify my reasoning. I had read this from Allan Gartner's site,..
http://www.wiringfordcc.com/track_2.htm#c4

So I looked upon this reverse section as its own power district? Yes, I do realize its too small to need to be a power district unto itself, but isn't already one by this very definition of NOT being connected to the main bus/busses?
 

I had thought I would have a main control board like Dave's that would have both PSX and PSX-AR mounted  on it and connected to their various buss wire respectively?
 

And that main board would be centrally located on this vertical post at the trunk of my peninsula,..then the various buss lines (both main ones and reverse ones) would disperse out from that central board with the PSX & PSX-AR boards on it,...
 

the reversing section is off

the reversing section is off the end of the bus, or off the side with nothing after it. It's always at the end, never in between sections

@barr_ceo

Your posting came along almost concurrently with mine just above it.

I'm not exactly sure of what you are saying? Does that most recent posting of mine make sense?

  YES ==bus==++===========

YES

==bus==++=========== ==reverser===++========++====

NEVER

==bus==++===== ==reverser===++========++==== ==more=bus=======

Clarify A. Gartner's Prohibition

Brian,

On the two sentences you copied from Gartner, read the one that you didn't underline. Your PSX-AR has two connections to a REVERSE section bus and two connections to the MAIN section bus. That underlined sentence could have been better written or even omitted; it's too easy to think that wiring to the PSX-AR is included by "in any way." It ain't.

Each of your three RevSecs draws its power thru its own PSX-AR, which draws its power from whatever booster is feeding the main bus at that spot.

DrJolS

Just a comment, but no

Just a comment, but no prototype railroad would install a double-slip switch for the location/purpose you've indicated in the plan posted above in post #1.

The big railroads install these ONLY in major terminals and only when space requirements require them.

  "how do you wire a

The sub bus only connects to the output of the auto reverser and to the track within the isolated reversing loop. It does not connect to the main bus. The purpose of the sub bus is to save wiring. Say your reverse loop is 4 sections of flex track in length, instead of running 4 sets of feeders from the auto reverser you can run a sub bus and tap feeders for each section of track from the sub bus till you get to the 4th section....DaveB

  So I excerpted these

So I excerpted these diagrams from the PSX-AR manual

***************************************************************************************************************

*******************************************************************************************************************

********************************************************************************************
 

Don't these diagrams indicate that I could locate BOTH the PSX & PSX-AR boards on my 'central control panel' and run bus wires to the individual track zones?   Then as you say run the needed feeders within those sections/zones of track??

What I think I am trying to do is locate all those PSX control boards all in one location, rather than putting different AR boards out remotely??

And yes these diagrams do show the interconnecting power lines for the various PSX boards??

Sorry to be an electrical idiot

  "Don't these diagrams

Yes, If they are mounted close to command station  they would just have longer wires on their output side and shorter wires on their input side. I don't know if there is any theoretical electrical advantage ro have the long wires before or after the units? Can someone with more DCC knowledge  comment on that? .....DaveB

PSX reversers

I was having trouble confirming that 4 PSX reversers had purchased from a club layout were in actuality reversers and not just power shields. Some detective work yesterday, and then confirmation this morning from Tony's Trains has confirmed that mine are reversers, just older models.
 

i think i will go forward with wiring these in, and keep in mind that I might replace them with the newer versions. (it will cost a little over $230 to replace them).