Options

Michael,

I know there have been several threads on this in the past, so I don't want to repeat myself too much. I think you will have to raise your price limit or be very patient.

The Bachmann shays were $300 full retail when they came out 15 years ago. So seeing them for $200 or more now isn't that far off... As for the brass PFMs very common class Bs, I see them generally in the $200-300 price range pretty consistently right now on Ebay. I didn't pay as much for mine but that has been several years ago...Most of the other brass has always been more expensive, probably due to its rarity..

I would avoid the MDC if possible...

If you are patient you might get one for your price but it would be an extremely good deal.

Guy

Wow!

I never have this kind of luck and this is almost too weird! Not twenty minutes after making this post and venting my frustration over being outbid, I check E-bay and another two truck MDC Shay kit pops up with a "Buy it Now" price of $85.00! Despite my reservations about the MDC, I couldn't resist and I pulled the trigger. It's now on it's way to me for just under $105.00 taxes and shipping included. I like to tinker with mechanical stuff anyway and I'm sure this will be a challenge but I'm super stoked right now. If worse comes to worse, and I can't make it work it looks like I can recoup all or part of  my investment judging by the experience I've had in the Shay market the last few days! What a day!

Nice find for 85 bucks, I

Nice find for 85 bucks, I don't think you can lose with that....at least not much. So I might be too late here, but if your still interested in another Shay, I have a Bachmann  Shay that I purchased around 2004 or so and would be interested in making a trade with. Not sure for what but if your interested just send me a private Email. 

Its a smooth running unit that I just put a decoder in a few months ago (purchased DCC ready). The reality is that this Shay has not been run very much. It has spent most of it's life in its box.

Oh man, I hear you...

Been there! 

My Shay jones took many years (and dollars) to address, and it certainly made me wonder the same thing: isn't this a clear opportunity for manufacturers, and Bachmann in particular? I presume that the whole experience was traumatic for them. I'm sure it's a serious can of worms when you're trying to cut down on the customer service costs, and I guess it's no picnic to address the things they would have to do differently to consider a new production run. 

I built my first MDC Shay about 30 years ago, took it slow and easy, and had it purring like a kitten which must have upset my cat because she knocked it to the floor with a heartbreaking, splintering crash. 

It took a long time to muster the resolve to try again, and I accumulated a couple of unopened- and several partially-built kits on eBay, along with NWSL replacement gears, etc. The bidding was shocking! 

I'm STILL intermittently working on those (and enjoying the process), but over the years I bought a couple of brass models with the idea of figuring out how to install DCC decoders and sound in them - still a pipe dream I'm afraid, so I got serious about scoring a Bachmann with DCC and sound designed in. Finally did it, but it took patience and a very reckless attitude towards any hope of retiring from full time employment. 

Hang in there Michael, and kiss your budget goodbye, and you'll eventually get what you're after!

Jeff Allen

Get the book

Michael,

That was quick! OK now track down the shay book by Jeff Johnston. He goes into great detail on how to build the MDC to run. Hopefully someone can lend you this book as it gets pretty crazy prices in the used book market right now

Guy

A cheaper Aussie option

Hi Michael,

A cheaper Aussie option may be to track down several articles in the Australian Model Railway Magazine by Wayne Weatherstone. Wayne is one of the best "Shay-tweeakers"  when it comes to the MDC. 

See  http://www.australianmodelrailways.com/amrm/search.php?search=Weatherstone&pid=6794&cb=5f08db542244f 

This article is available on CD as part of  https://www.eveleighpress.com.au/item.php?id=528 

Given that you are buying it at 7/10 of the Aussie price, perhaps this might get you started?

Shay

If you think it's tough in the HO scale Shay market. Try looking for an N scale. Only 1 ready to run was made that I can find and it is an Atlas. It took me several years to finally land 1 last fall at a price my budget could take. Then found a second a couple months later for a friend. Congrats on your find and good luck on getting it running. It is always satisfying to get those sweet deals.

Later Richard

N-scale

I was an N -scale modeler for many years. I finally got to the point where my nerves wouldn't take working with MT couplers anymore and decided to make the move to HO and Kadee #5's. Of course the smallest detail is still the smallest detail and there's some pretty fiddly stuff in HO that would just be part of the body casting in N but that's another story. I was lucky enough to have a good friend that gave me an Atlas Shay that wasn't running right and he didn't have the patience to repair it. Later when I did make the jump to HO I passed on my good fortune by gifting it to someone else and as far as I know, that little bugger is still going strong!

Some amateur insight on the shay market by yours truly...

Shays are unusual.  They were rarely used by Class One railroads.  They aren't so hot at maintaining high speeds.  They're REALLY complicated on a mechanical level.  So there are several reasons why a manufacturer would want to steer clear of shays.  Their nature, temperment, engineering, and history can all be summed up in one word... unusual.  So it's only natural that there wouldn't be a lot of shays out there.

HOWEVER...

Shays were a common locomotive on narrow gauge railways, making it worthwhile for Bachmann to model them in On30.  Shays were reliable (albeit slow) operators that could handle grades which would stall out virtually any other locomotive (regardless of load).  They were compact and could navigate tight curves.  They didn't slip much.  They were pretty good pullers.  If you were a narrow gauge railroad owner, the odds were pretty high that you had a shay or other geared loco, and so if you were a narrow gauge MODELER, chances were pretty fair that you'd want a shay.  So if you were a serious manufacturer of North American narrow gauge, logically it made good sense (and $$$) to produce a shay.

Then there's O-scale (standard gauge).  Although not nearly as popular as in On30, High-Rail shays are still fairly profitable because, well, most O-scale high-rail (3rd rail) modelers were just collecting whatever locomotives they took a fancy to... and who doesn't love a good complicated shay? (especially if you don't have to build it yourself!)

And then there's G-gauge.  Possibly the best scale for buying a shay in (besides On30).  Bachmann Spectrum Fn3 shays can be got for prices comparable to those of high-end HO scale brass shays.  And THEN there's the abundance of live steam shays!  I think that's why shays and g-gauge go so well together.  A live steam shay is possibly one of the most impressive model locomotives in existence.

Of course, I'm probably making myself sound like more of an expert than I really am.  Just my five cents.

Yes, Shays are Unusual

Which is the very reason I think so many modelers are in love with them. Obviously the have been pretty well represented in HO by manufacturers in the past, there's a lot of them out there if you want to pay the premium prices. I consider myself lucky to get the MDC model I got for the price I did but I have no illusions about this being an easy project which is why I wish a manufacturer would do a new run with DCC and sound. I'd gladly put down serious bucks for that. I'd actually prefer to spend my time detailing my now mostly complete pike rather than wrestling with this old kit but ya gotta do what ya gotta do.

Here's a Shay on display at the museum of what I tongue in cheek refer to as my "accidental and after the fact prototype". I call it that because I reasoned out many of the parameters of my little freelance line, like why it was standard and not narrow gauge, only to find out about the existence of a similar real life railroad that had once run in the location that is my favorite vacation spot. My line is more whimsical because that's my style but this is what has become it's de facto inspiration and it's why I now have Shay fever...

Shays wew typical logging

Shays wew typical logging locomotives, narrow and standard gauge. The were built for steep grades, tight curves, and rough track and provided a good pulling power as all weight was on the drive wheels.

They are complicated as models but that hasn't detained brass importers from more than 15,000 Shay locomotives of different types in HO-scale alone. PFM alone imported about 13,000. Only PFM had reliable numbers.

Brass Shays can easily be found at reasonable prices at brass dealers and on ebay. So manufacturers may not see a market large enough for a mass-produced Shay locomotive. OTOH the Bachmann Shays were quite a success though the first run had the gear problems.
Regards, Volker

Look for a Brass PFM model

If your willing to put that amount of work into an MDC, you may as well invest the time and money into one of these. I picked this one up at a train show for $175.00. It already has a Canon motor in it. I cleaned, lubricated, added LED's, including one for the firebox flicker.A decoder with sound and keep alive and I have a solid shay for the rest of my life. (video below)

PFM really has a well designed mechanism that is pretty much flawless, the main improvement to be made one the is the track pickups. They are simple to disassemble and finely detailed.

I picked up a second one and documented some of my progress here.

http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/2017/09/a-new-to-me-pfmunited-brass-2-truck-shay.html

The Jungle Shays:

https://www.railarchive.net/nyccollection/nyc7189.htm

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/nyc1900.jpg

http://members.tripod.com/olde_logging/shay-1896_bp.jpg

City jungle of course.

Lutz

Better in On30

Shays seem to look and run a lot better in On30. I have an HO scale Bachmann shay, and it's a really cool locomotive, but it doesn't run that well, and it sounds really weird if it's more than just creeping along. Although if you need to make a very small HO layout seem big, well, the shay will probably do it.

AlexW said: "Shays seem to

Shay Shortages

I had a very similar discussion with a fellow modeler about the lack of new shays in HOn3 a couple of weeks ago. One of the realizations I had which applies to narrow gauge and standard gauge shays is that it is a nich market waiting to be found by someone who has the ability to turn out x number of locos in a year. Using Precsion Scale parts and coming up with a frame, boiler, tender, cab I suspect someone could make a bit of money on the side. Not necessarily a living.

I have 3 of the MDC HOn3 locos still in kit form + the book. My neighbor, a fellow MRer challenged me to get one out and give it a 2nd try. I opened the box and took a look.

Both the HO and the HOn3 models are great runners if you are up to and willing to put the time into them or so the rumor mill goes.

In the last year I have seen 2 brass models go through our LHS. Both were bought by a local collector. Have seen them at the local train show also.

Jack

Here's My Bachmann Shay

Ancient version with self-added DCC.

Another Video

Here's another Bachmann shay  - for fun

Guy

MDC Shays and LRR

MDC Shays's can be fun to build and run or a PITA. I have built more than a dozen MDC Shays (mostly for modelers who got frustrated) and sill have four or more finished models. I am not sure how many kits I have, but this is a reminder to check. Most of my kits were purchased at shows when vendors found it hard to unload the kits, as the most I ever paid was probably under $20. I am totally surprised at how much suckers - er I mean modelers - are willing to pay for these engines.

Now if properly built MDCs will out pull the B(otched)mann Shays by at least three to one, but unless you put a lot of work into the MDCs, the Bmann do look better. I have five Bmann HOs - two to run and the other two for the necessary spare parts to keep the two running. NorthWest Short Line (NWSL) makes replacement drives and gears for the MDCs (which I like and have installed) for those who can not get the stock drives to run reliably. At one time the NWSL drives were, what I considered, reasonably priced, but they are now going for about $50. This may actually still be reasonable considering the prices the engine and kits are going for.

As for the Little River Railroad Museum Shay, it needs some tender loving care. With the Lock Down volunteers have not been able to do normal upkeep at the museum. I need to do a lot of work on the garden layout. It would also be nice to run my Large Scale Shays (see below), Climaxes and Heislers which are gathering dust.

If you can not find a copy of Jeff Johnston's book, let me know, as I may be able to loan you one.

Note: Museum members have the bell and builders plate for 2147.

The Bachmann Shay also didn't

Does anyone make a decent sound module for a shay?

I've ridden behind the shay at the Yosemite Mtn. Sugar Pines Railroad, and with 3 cylinders geared to a max speed of about 15 mph, a Shay sounds like it is high balling at 80 mph at slightly faster than walking speed!  That may be a bit of an exageration, but when one is running at 10 mph, it sounds like it is flying!

Toma Model Works

I never bought anything for them, and as a On30 modeller, I'm not interested, but I saw that Toma Model Works is now working on an HOn30 Shay:

https://tomamw.miiduu.com/

Shay Sounds

One of the better Shay sound sets, which as I recall were recorded at Cass, WV, was available in QSI Solutions Quantum Revolution series of decoders. I have two of these decoders in Large Scale Shays which sound great. QSIS decoders include a chuff input, so the sounds are easily synchronized with the engine. This sound set does not appear to be available in the current QSI decoders.

With appropriate selection of sounds and a bit of tuning the SoundTraxx Tsunamis can sound quite good. The original Tsunamis had chuff inputs which provided synchronization, but with the Tsunami2s and Econamis you have to mess with "Dynamic Digital Exhaust" to APPROXIMATE sound synchronization. This is OK with smaller scales where it is hard to see the positions of the shafts, rods, arms and levers, but can look totally wrong in Large Scale (really awful in my articulated 2-4-4-2 and 2-6-6-2).

@Ken K

I have become quite enamored with the LRR over the past few years and I can't believe I went as long as I did with the Smokies being my favorite vacation spot and not knowing of it's existence. If not for a chance finding of the book "Last Train to Elkmont" in the National Park Visitors center, I might still not know about it.

My last vacation there was October of 2019 and I came by the museum on what should have been an open day according to the info I had but unfortunately, it was closed. At one point I seem to recall seeing a map of the railroad in the gift shop and I didn't buy it and I've always regretted that. I was hoping to look for it and buy it that day. I also had a few links about LRR saved here but seemed to have lost them.

For not being a "prototype modeler" per se, I sure have become a huge fan of the LRR. The picture I already shared and this one are from that last October 2019 trip.

P.S. Has anyone ever attempted a "trackplan" of the LRR? I think one of the links I had was about building a garden railroad version of it but I don't remember it including a trackplan.