Well, that's

exactly what supports my two 32' 2 x 4 peninsulas(8' tall), and gravity still likes me.  Seriously, though, I built each in 8' modules with a 9' tall stud on one end, normal 8'on the other; made it dead easy to raise one section at a time, tie the short stud end to the adjacent tall stud and the new tall stud to the floor joists above, and keep going.  The sections are nailed to the concrete floor, naturally, but other than that they're 'free standing'.  My intent was to have a 90-degree Y at the freestanding end(i.e. two short legs at 45 degrees to the main wall), to allow a Bellina-drop box-in, but it's not there yet and I'm not seeing any problems.  My studs are at 16" centers, as I fasten the horizontal joists for my shelves to them.

Blair

You might also utilize a few

You might also utilize a few steel brackets with a U-shape extending up the side of the wall with a steel plate welded to the base of the U which is then bolted to the floor using redhead or tapcon type fastenenrs.  It would cost a little more, but should eliminate the need for any studs attached to the floor joists above.  I may not be describing it well.

Something lie this: __U__

Peninsulas

I have two peninsulas on my layout. One has storage cabinets underneath so has the backdrop fastened to the back of the cabinets and no connection to the ceiling. The other is free standing with a 2 by 4 extending to the ceiling joists at the far end and another halfway from the layout tie in point and the end( the span between 2 by 4 's is about 6 feet.) Both tall 2 by 4's attach to the wood floor and to the ceiling joist with angle brackets. In between the tall 2 by 4's I spaced the shorter backdrop supports about 16 inches on center. Front and back faces of the backdrop were then covered with masonite.  I agree with the desire to have open space above the backdrop, mine are set at a height where I can look over the top by stretching up a bit, very handy to see who came in the room or to look outside and see what the weather is doing....DaveB

Edit, I was going from memory but today I was out working on the layout and measured the span between the two tall 2 by 4's and it is 4 ft. 3 inches instead of 6 feet. The total peninsula length is 8 feet....Dave

Hanging from the Ceiling?

Perhaps that upper peninsula could be fashioned to hang from the ceiling?

...

Now there's a dandy of an idea - Thanks!!!

My reaction to this is that

My reaction to this is that running a 2x4 up to the ceiling is probably overkill. You're not trying to suspend the thing from the ceiling, the weight will rest on the floor, (that's what the floor is for), you're just trying to keep the thing from tipping over. So maybe you could do with as little as fishing line or small steel cables from the top of the divider up to the ceiling joists and put under tension. 

You could significantly enhance the stability against tipping over by making the feet of the wall upside-down T's (the bars of the T stick out toward the aisle along the floor, but not all the way to the aisle, maybe a foot in each direction).

Another option would be Randy Seiler's 1x1" square steel tubing. If you had a piece of that running up to the ceiling  joists at either end of your peninsula it would be less visually distracting than a 2x4 by quite a bit, yet just as stiff. If you weld the upside-down T feet to the bottom end that I mentioned nothing would be going anywhere.

It will work.

Dear "Remhed",
I see your idea working fine. Just two cautions from my experience:
1. Nails will pull out when nailed into end grain and subject to force pulling them out. I mean that your layout lower level weight hanging on the lowest horizontal 2x4 in your drawing will pull out the nails holding  it to the vertical 2x4s. To remedy you could use joist hangers on those joints with end grain nailing, or just turn your supports "flat face on" so you can then nail your horizontal pieces onto the face. That gives nailing across the grain. Hope that is clear.
2. You would want to add some diagonal attachment to the ceiling joists at your support connections, just to keep your peninsula from swinging when someone leans on it heavily, or you run trains around the corner at scale 130 mph (MILW?).
Hope this is helpful. I like your ideas and the other ideas from Blair, Rob, Dave, Brian and E Dub Ya. All are stored away in mind for future use! I think the cabinet idea would be really stable and eliminate any tendency to swing.
Douglas

Hanging Upper Peninsula Deck

Hanging Upper Peninsula Deck

When I first began to think about that upper peninsula deck I wanted for my logging locos, naturally I thought why not just 2 or 3 vertical columns coming up from the floor, thru the lower peninsula deck, then supporting the upper peninsula deck,....could be fashioned out of relatively small cross section metal tube, etc, and not too invasive to the bottom scene.
 

But then I thought about it some more and said why not hang it from the ceiling's 2x4 frames. At first I thought just using wire cable,...almost fishing wire size,..plenty strong. But that would allow things to 'swing' . Why not just 'all-tread rod', camouflaged as some sort of tall antenna, screwed into the ceiling studs, and bolted to my steel or alum backbone beam of the upper peninsula deck.

Pretty clean and strong upper deck support. Haven't completed mine yet, but I have not thought of anything better yet.

Peninsula support

I have a blog on the MRH site about the extension of my N scale layout.

The new track plan include two large peninsula in the middle of the room.

I have designed metallic support to avoid as much as possible foots under the peninsula.

The design need some knowledge to solder structural metallic parts together.

Even if I designed them for a single level layout, I could be easy to solder at the appropriate heigh a second arm for  the support of a second level.

Theses supports could be also easily done in wood from the base of the design

1. Side view

2. Front view

that's the ticket

Great pic, #1 is what I was suggesting in words. Except the OP doesn't want to run their backdrop all the way to the ceiling or have a valence dropping down from the ceiling, but that's really a preference detail chosen after the basic construction technique is settled.

You say soldering, I say welding for construction. The inverted T's or inverted T's with extra arms could be welded together offsite and then stood up and braced to the ceiling joists, with the lengthwise connector at layout-level bolted to them rather than welded.

Design, don't over think it.

   A layout is not very heavy so doesn't need anything exotic to hold it up. 2 by 4  by 8 studs cost less than $3 bucks so hard to beat for price and ease of construction. My peninsula in the photo( photo is tall so scroll  down to see the floor) is about 8 feet long and has two  2 by 4's tied to the ceiling joists with metal angle brackets and to the floor with similar brackets and that's enough to make the layout section rigid. I added shorter intermediate 2 by's extending from the floor to the top of the backdrop then screwed on metal shelf brackets to support the benchwork box grid. If desired instead of the metal shelf brackets one could add more legs to the front of the benchwork and create long narrow table then screw the assembly to the floor and eliminate the ceiling joist tie in but that wouldn't be as simple to construct or as efficient a use of material.....DaveB

@eastwind

You have right welding is the correct designation

I'm an iron worker by formation so I prefer to weld my support together.

This is quicker than drilling and bolted the tubes together

The support valence like mentioned in my sketch is an option, my valence will be hanged on the ceiling.

Each support has a rectangular tabs, colored in green in the following sketch, these are used to connect support together and support the frame of each modules, since I build in a look like Toma system my layout, the modules frames are in purple blue.

All the connecting support between post showed in the front view sketch are bolted to each support

A template will be first prepared to build them in serial, I need around 12 of them for my peninsula  and around 25 simple wall post around the  room

The following sketch of supports are for along the wall support, they follow the same approach as the peninsula post; they are bolted into the wall and on the ground; ( a return green tube legs which is on the ground  is missing in the sketch) they follow the same 7.5' space between them and are just there to support the frame of the module which are bolted to these wall support.

Again valence support is optional and will be not used.

But anyway, these support could be easily modified to support a double deck layout design

All the tubes could be bolted together but this is a lost in rigidity and need a lot a precise work to be all similar, drilling holes in iron need a good drill.

The post could be build in wood quiet easily using the double frame structure and using quiet big wood profiles; but again these need drilling and for sure a template to produce identical support

These supports design are old, I have build a few when I still lived in Europe for a friend layout; I have somewhere a picture where we are both on a peninsula support working to hang the backdrop…..I'm like him around 162 pounds each…...yes these designed post are really strong !

The second sketch is the frame of the modules; these are very rigid and have allowed me to move my layout severals times without any distortion of the wood structure including a move accross the Atlantic

Thanks for the ideas...

Thanks for all the ideas guys...  I think what I am going to do is build the wall out of 2x3's and tie it to the ceiling every 8' per original design.  I may be able to get away with it being free standing with the inverted "T" idea at the bottom for stability, which I may still add in a few spots, but I just don't want it to be unstable.  I think once I get the first wall up and experiment a bit.

Just remember,

tie-ing it to the ceiling is one thing, but you'll have to anchor the bottom to the floor, too.

Blair

If the lumber at your

If the lumber at your neighborhood store looks to wet, go for steel studs instead.

Steel lumber - No

I know some folks love steel lumber - i guess it is what you are used to.  I have never worked with it and don't see any reason to now just for this peninsula wall.

tie-ing it to the ceiling is

Why ??

My upper deck peninsula will NOT have to be anchored to the floor.

So it doesn't swing.

So it doesn't swing. The upside-down 'T' feet solve the same problem without messing up the floor, but provide something to stub your toes on.

T’s of both persuasions

If an upside down T sitting on the floor doesn’t tip, a rightside up T fastened to the ceiling shouldn’t swing.

"If an upside down T sitting

An upside down T would have to be well fastened to the ceiling to not swing, same as a right side up T on the floor. The advantage of fastening a 2 by 4 to the ceiling and the floor is much better leverage against swing inducing stress, using only one attachment point at floor and ceiling. ....DaveB 

Both ends is simpler

Agreed, fastening a 2x4 at both floor and ceiling is simpler.  But if for some reason you can’t fasten at top or bottom one vigorously fastened end should be enough.

I you can’t attach at either top or bottom, well, how long do you think a module suspended from drones could stay up before a motor or prop broke?

Mininum Attachments

If the hanging deck backbone rib was held up with 2-3 vertical pieces of stiff 1/2" all-thread rod screwed into the framing (wood studs) of the ceiling, I think it would be very resistant to swinging.

If swinging was excessive then perhaps 2 diagonals of fishing line led over to small eye-hooks screwed into widely spaced frames at the sides would take care of that. I've held a whole heavy cut-glass light fixture from my 2x2 wood ceiling frames with a single hooked eye screw.

Very small footprint on the ceiling.

My Take on This

I believe your original plan is the best plan with your givens.

Easy to do

When we moved to our new house I decided that the new layout would not be supported from the floor anywhere. This was very easy to do using John Sterling shelving support brackets and standards. However, However, there were 3 posts in the way. One post was moved slightly. That post and another were then built in to the wall.

The third was impossible to move. However, it was in the middle of the peninsula. I decided that I might as well use it in the layout construction. I framed it in 1 by lumber and used it to bring power down below the layout.

The layout would use L girders as support. I determined how long the girders could be without sagging and built a support column duplicating the size of the post cover. I made it long enough to attach to a floor joist and the level for the L girder installation.

More to come with photos soon as I skim the pictures for appropriate views to help.

Lou