I haven't used the WS risers,

I haven't used the WS risers, but I always wondered why they didn't offer a transition riser.  Not good form to go from flat to 2% in 1/8"!

On my mostly-flat layout, when I have transitioned to a grade, I cut thru the foam for about  12 inches, parallel to, and on each side of the track (or where the track will be), making it perhaps an inch wider than the track/ballast profile - think"cookie cutter", but still attached/intact at the zero-grade end.  Then I lift the cut-out end up to the grade I want, and slip foam shims in the cuts to help hold, while I glue the cuts for a permanent hold.

As I said, my layout is mostly flat, and I use the transition to go from full mainline ballast profile to flat yard, or down a bit into a mining yard. The yard tracks are glued directly to the foam.

There is no reason that you couldn't use this method to transition up to a full incline; 2% or whatever.  Just make the cut-out longer as needed to ease the transition.

The WS risers are a complete system.

They work great and simple. I think they have as gradual a transition as you can make with the white foam.

I am not sure about the top of the grade transition because I modified that end of the foam. The only downside is that you have to get a whole pack at a time, even if your only using one piece. 

Grade starters, Custom foam grades..

IIRC WS has something called a grade starter. Would that not be a transitional thing?

As far as custom grades, I at one time had the idea of using 2inch blue or pink foam to make grade ramps, starting at zero level at one end corner of the eight foot long sheet and then using a long board to draw a line to the other end at a level of two inches for about 2%, three inches for about 3%. etc. This math works because eight feet is 96 inches, very close to 100 inches. I hope I'm explaining that clearly enough. You would have to make frequent saw kerfs partially into the foam to curve it where needed, much like the WS product is designed. It may sound like a lot of work but it would give you custom, in between, grade percentages. I never actually tried the idea out but did something similar making ramps of foamcore that supported some foamcore  sub roadbed I cut for an N-scale layout. I would not have trusted the foamcore for any larger scale though.

Foamcore Ramps

Wondering why you feel this way?

There are a number of different products referred to as foamcores, some paper coated. Some not as good as others. I think some folks even refer to gatorboard as a foamcore.

What brand did you use, or do you recall?

I'm seriously thinking of using foamcore roadbed under my tracks in the logging scene, then blocking up the roadbed with foam blocks.

BTW, here are some postings by Prof Klyzlr who seems to have lots of experience with foamcores.
https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/laying-track-on-foamcore-12198189
 

I should have checked instead

I should have checked instead of just speculating/remembering.  WS does indeed have incline starter sets, but they seem to just be wedges of the same gradient (2, 3, or 4 percent), so still not allowing the gradual transition from zero to 2 percent.

Their product link here.

I got the idea of using

I got the idea of using foamcore from an MR article on a small N scale layout and at the time the conventional wisdom seemed to be that anything bigger than an N-scale loco would be to heavy. I shouldn't say it can't be done because I didn't try anything bigger at the time. I not only used the foamcore as subroadbed but for the supporting grade ramps as well. I didn't use any foam blocks. I was on a budget (as always) so it was the cheaper stuff. I've seen what the prof does building foamcore benchwork and I'll be interested to see what you come up with. My biggest point is that it should be possible to cut custom grade ramps in whatever type of material you choose.

Cookie cutter

Why not cookie cutter?  Its worked for the last 50-60 years.

Why not do cookie cutter with foam?  Use thinner foam sheets (1/2"-1" ) and cookie cutter the top sheet, then build up foam risers/blocks under it to whatever grade you want.  I built a layout for my son a decade or so ago, a figure 8 with an up and over and used cookie cutter foam.  It worked.

Cookie Cutter

@Dave,
Couldn't it still be referred to as cookie cutter if I use 1/4" or sightly thicker foamcore to span the distances between the riser blocks (made of foam likely) ?  Just thought it would be as easy as the 1/2" to 1" thick foam sheet material spanning the risers??

And it just so happens that I collected up quite a bit of different foam core/board scrap product at one of my local sign shops.

The more direct link to one of the Prof's observations about the load carrying of foamcore is here,..
https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/laying-track-on-foamcore-12198189

I also have a bunch of these type 'foam blocks' (packaging types) that could be cut down to make the risers. not sure exactly what kind of foam it is, but it holds up great,...had for years now cushioning things in my transport/storage trailer.
 

custom grades in foam

   The stuff is easy to cut with a hot wire so should be possible to set up guide battens of wood on each side of the foam and slide the hot wire along them. A piece of nichrome wire from Woodland scenics and a DC power pack to get the wire hot is all that's required for the cutter circuitry . The wire can be stretched between two wooden sticks to make a frame. Radio control modelers use the same technique to make wing foils which is a lot harder to shape than making a constant grade....DaveB

Hot Wire Tool

I actually have a hot wire tool, ...a used one that I have never experimented with. May have to break that out and give it a try. But then I need to buy some more foam sheets to be able to make them up to 4 inches tall,...and to make the double track mainline one for the lower deck.

Another good foamcore posting

Another good foamcore posting by Prof Klyzlr,...with LOTS of photos,..

https://forum.mrhmag.com/magazine-feedback-was-ezines-891776

Incline starters

WS Incline starters do start out extremely thin and end in the % grade to match whatever you've chosen. You can also achieve 1% increments by using risers in combination. Instructions are on the packaging explaining how to do this. I've always been dubious of claims for grades of 1/2%. Considering the short distances traveled on our layouts is that really required? I've used hundreds of feet of the foam risers and inclines building large layouts and wouldn't use anything else. They are simple, quick, goof proof.

2.6% Grade

So how do you obtain a 2.6% grade over say a 70" span,...as an example?? (using Woodland Scenics)

2.6% grade

The elevation gain is a given. The % of grade to get there is a choice. I may be wrong, however, I doubt your trains are going to find a significant difference between 2.6% and 3.0%. So I'd choose 3% to get where I need to go and take slightly less than 70' to get there. It's a choice.

Why do math?

Much as I love a little arithmetic and an intellectual exercise, there is no need for that.  If you’ve got a particular elevation you need to reach, and a distance over which need you to reach it, and it’s under 8 feet, just draw it out on a scrap piece of lumber and use that as a template to find what height to cut risers to fit in any location along the grade.  Don’t forget to allow for the vertical transition curves at each end.

Importance of Grades

From what I have read on the forums, it seems there is a lot of emphasis placed on trying keep grades at 2% or less. So I was thinking there might be a great deal of difference between 2.6 and 3.0% ??

That's why I've been doing my best to keep my grades low. But in some case my layout and trackplan won't allow for a more expansive runout. So its a matter of trying to achieve the best I can,...on my mainlines,...and this one track in the logging area is a loop of my mainline thru my helix (on the other side of that back wall) up there.

BTW here is a view of that area,...
 

Some long alum tubes strung across some segments to help visualize grades,...

riser spacing dictates grade

you don't need risers abutting one another.   they can be spaced out.   If the height of each riser increases by 1/4", then a riser is needed approx every 9.5" for 2.6% grade.

as Ken suggested, put your roadbed in place with the correct height and easement at each end and place a riser under the roadbed just snugly to support the roadbed. 

Why do the Math

I do understand what you are saying there. I don't think I would ever try to math out those riser heights. Much better to use a pattern like you suggest,..

I will likely lay out some sort of pattern like you suggest (I have several long pieces of alum that might come in handy). I figure I would have to make the pattern represent the 'top of the railhead' for that incline, then bring the combo foamcore, cork roadbed, and track up to that pattern's height,...at which point I would insert some foam riser pieces cut to the proper height to hold things in place.

BTW I already discovered one 'vertical transition' hotspot on one of my 'helix tunnels'.  I made the tunnel too flat coming thru the wall, so I need to go back and angle it down just a little.

used Woodland Scenics risers

I used Woodland Scenics risers on an N scale HCD layout (two in an "L") I built almost 20 years ago now, I cut risers lengthwise with a hot wire cutter, and used yardsticks clamped to each side of the riser as a guide. It's a greqt way to do it, and when the time came to move it my ex and I picked up the whole layout and put it in the U-Haul on top of everything else from our apartment and moved it 900 miles north.

About grades and train length

Something I learned long ago and always try to keep in mind. It's pretty pointless to worry about how many cars locos can pull up a given grade if the train ends up longer than your passing sidings. (Assuming single track main) In other words, it doesn't do much good to have a loco that can pull 12 cars up the grade if your longest passing siding will only hold the loco and 10 cars. If there's a situation where that logic doesn't apply, it's pretty rare.

Grades on a model railroad are always a compromise anyway. The prototype does there best to avoid grades or minimizes them as much as possible. My pike has a 4% switchback grade. It was a necessary compromise to get a scenic effect I wanted. Of course it is a logging and mining line so there's that. I used the WS system for the grade. Maybe it's not the most flexible way to do it but it sure is convenient.

Canal or Washboard effect

Perhaps I am viewing this incline business with a jaunted eye?

A number of folks have suggested that the WS foam riser sets could be spaced apart some distance to effect an overall change in grade. But wouldn't that spacing be effectively creating what I might refer to as a canal effect,...series of locks raising and lowering the water level, then a constant level in between the sets of locks? Might also be a washboard effect??

When I began looking at some of my inclines on my desired track plans, I thought I detected some that were going to exceed the recommended practices. It was at that point that I thought it might result in the lowest overall increase in grade IF the grading was carried out over the ENTIRE length of track available. That's when I began to come up with 'fractional' grades that were not met by the stock grades offered by WS.

Yes, I certainly like the looks and usability of their system, but it seems to me that the older cookie cutter methods with 'adjustable risers' makes sense if one is looking to tweak the incline grades.

Foamed PVC

I mentioned that I had collected up some scrap materials from my sign shop. One of them was this stuff, 'foamed PVC'. So happens my is of the black variety. Here is one site I found describing the material,...

https://stratongroup.com/blog/everything-you-need-to-know-about-pvc-foam-boards/

Specifically I have this brand
https://www.palram.com/us/product/palight-pvc-flat-sheets/

 

all-foam cookie-cutter style

Good illustration/contribution

Quote:

My layout is an all-foam cookie-cutter construction. The sub-roadbed is 3/4-inch blue foam. I cut the pink foam risers on a miter saw.

My layout is N-scale, but I was inspired by an HO layout that uses the same construction method.

- Jeff
 

 Good illustration Jeff, sort of what I had in mind,...except I would like to have a thinner sub-roadbed. Perhaps 1/4" foamcore material?