Deemiorgos

I have this hopper a weathered using a photo of the prototype,

_0011(6).jpg 

but I have no idea what was in these cars and where its destinations would be.

Reply 0
AzBaja

Potash, 98.7% sure

some sort of cement, potash, fertilizer or kolin powder substance 

Toronto, Hamilton and Buffalo Railway was still moving a wide variety of freight (despite its cessation of passenger services after April 26, 1981) that included auto parts, acid, fertilizer, fencing, agriculture and farming products, steel, paper, lumber, pipe, tires, and tin cans 

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/mth-premier-100-ton-toronto-hamilton-1807560340

MTH Website "Toronto Hamilton and Buffalo is a Potash company"

https://www.pwrs.ca/announcements/view.php?ID=371

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/13/t/220203.aspx

http://trainiax.net/mephotosearchresults.php?p_mark=THB

 

Where is this location?  what is it.  Looks like the same discoloration of your car,  Maybe moving the same product.

 

AzBaja
---------------------------------------------------------------
I enjoy the smell of melting plastic in the morning.  The Fake Model Railroader, subpar at best.

Reply 0
blindog10

what does the fine print on the model say?

It may or may not give you a clue. The prototype photo reads: NO CONCENTRATES RETURN TO MAITLAND, CANADA WHEN EMPTY Well I looked up Maitland Canada on Google Maps and it's downriver from Toronto which means I don't think it was on the TH&B. There is a big DuPont plant there along with a Dyno Nibel Nitrogen plant, plus what looks like a pipeline terminal. Only saw tank cars at DuPont, and mostly tank cars at Dyno. Now what those plants were called or what they did in the '60s is for someone else to answer. I shot a few of these cars here in the States over the years and got the impression they were carrying potash from Saskatchewan. They were definitely not carrying kaolin clay from the Southeastern US. Scott Chatfield
Reply 0
AzBaja

phosphate

TH&B 73 and 402 are southbound on the Dunnville Subdivision with over 45 cars of phosphate rock for ERCO at Port Maitland.

In the 1980s, a fertilizer plant in Port Maitland, Ontario, started receiving unit trains of phosphate rock from Florida. As well, they received unit trains of sulphuric acid from Northern Ontario. 

 

AzBaja
---------------------------------------------------------------
I enjoy the smell of melting plastic in the morning.  The Fake Model Railroader, subpar at best.

Reply 0
grenadier1943

Soylent Green!

It's people!!!

Mike

Chessie WM

0-2right.gif

Read my blog

Reply 0
Chris VanderHeide cv_acr

Empty Return

Actually it says:

xxxxxxxING CONCENTRATES
            RETURN TO
 PORT MAITLAND CANADA
           WHEN EMPTY

The COTS stencil block has obliterated the first part of the word, but it is probably "Smelting Concentrates"

Reply 0
Chris VanderHeide cv_acr

Not likely potash, and definitely not kaolin

No sources of these minerals anywhere on the TH&B system.

Reply 0
AzBaja

No sources of these minerals anywhere on the TH&B system?

No sources of these minerals anywhere on the TH&B system.,

You assume that they are shipping.  The could be receiving.   it also looks like PORT MAITLAND is a port.  So moving bulk from some place else to ship would be useful and supply your own cars to shippers out of area also makes sure that your railroads making money.

Facts about the TH&B

Miles of Track - 111
Locomotives - 17
Freight cars - 1121
Commodities - Fertilizer, Chemicals, Iron and Steel

"About 95% of potash is used for fertilizer in agriculture"

Still think Potash is the best choice.

 

AzBaja
---------------------------------------------------------------
I enjoy the smell of melting plastic in the morning.  The Fake Model Railroader, subpar at best.

Reply 0
jimfitch

Something white?

Something white?

.

Jim Fitch
northern VA

Reply 0
mesimpson

Cement or Lime

While some potash was occasionally shipped in the slabsides, the main potash producing area served by CP is in Saskatchewan.  CP had dedicated boxcars with roof hatches and cylindrical hoppers in that service generally.  Potash (potassium chloride) is also pink to reddish pink so the staining would be more along those lines. 

The TH&B would likely be more common in cement or lime service.  One thing to remember is that once the TH&B became 100% CP owned (circa 1981?) and possibly before then, the TH&B cars were used across the CP system so could be servicing any CP customer. 

Marc Simpson

Reply 0
Chuck P

Potash

Plenty via Google. Rapido's website, others have more.

HO - Western New York - 1987 era
"When your memories are greater than your dreams, joy will begin to fade."
Reply 0
Deemiorgos

Great info, thank you all.  

Great info, thank you all.

Reply 0
Chris VanderHeide cv_acr

TH&B Historical Society

Deemiorgos, try reaching out to the TH&B group, someone there might have a better answer on THB covered hopper assignments:

http://www.thbrailway.ca/

Reply 0
Deemiorgos

Great idea, Chris van der

Great idea, Chris van der Heide. Thanks!

Reply 0
Jim at BSME

Image analysis

Looking at the prototype photo the word before CONCENTRATES is not NO, as the stencil pattern for the letter after the N is not the same as the O in CONCENTRATES and it looks more like the C. So looks like a word ending in INC.

- Jim B.
Baltimore Society of Model Engineers, Estd. 1932
O & HO Scale model railroading
Check out BSME on: FacebookInstagram
Reply 0
Lance Brown

TH&B 2800 Series Covered Hoppers

 A brief assignment summary on the 2800 series slabside covered hoppers.

This fleet was larger and older hen the 1500 series cylindrical covered hopper, therefore the assignments were a little more diverse.

Information is spotty on the initial assignments of the first 20 cars purchased in 1956, but there is documentation showing four cars assigned to lime loading at Cyanimid in Niagara Falls to Consolidation - Dominion Mines in Spragge, ON and an additional four cars assigned to Brunner Mond in Amherstburg for soda ash loading to International Nickel in Port Colborne, with additional cars assigned to cement loading at Canada Cement in Port Colborne.

By 1962, industrial development at Port Maitland had peaked and the roster of 2800''s had grown to 60 cars assigned as follows:

14 in dolomite service at Steetley Industries on the H&D Branch in Dundas.
1 car in superphosphate service at Canadian Industries Limited on the Hamilton Belt Line. 
23 in zinc concentrate service between Sherbrooke Metallurgical in Port Maitland and Meadowbrook, West Virginia. 
5 in feed service at Robin Hood in Port Colborne. 
2 in soda ash loading at Brunner Mond in Amherstburg for International Nickel in Port Colborne. 
5 in superphosphate service at Dominion Fertilizer at Port Maitland. 
1 in urea service at Cyanimid on the Hamilton Belt Line.
4 in lime service between Domtar in Beachville and Cyanimid in Niagara Falls.
4 cars were unassigned at that time.

Incerased traffic at Port Maitland resulted in an additional 30 cars being acquired in 1964, bringing the roster to 90. In 1971, the assignment of the fleet was as follows :

14 in zinc concentrate service at Sherbrooke Metallurgical for loading to Meadowbrook, West Virginia. 
56 in fertilizer service (phosphate, superphosphate and calcium phosphate) at ERCO in Port Maitland.
3 in soda ash loading at Allied Chemical in Amherstburg for Dominion Glass on the Hamilton Belt Line.
3 in dolomite service at Steetley Industries on the H&D Branch in Dundas.
6 cars in tripolyphosphate service at ERCO in Port Maitland for shipments to Proctor & Gamble on the Hamilton Belt Line and Lever Brothers and Colgate-Palmolive in Toronto. 
1 car assigned to lime service at Cyanimid in Niagara Falls.
5 cars were stored pending heavy repairs and one car had been destroyed. 

By 1977, ERCO had sold the bulk of their Port Maitland operations to International Minerals and Chemicals (IMC) and Sherbrooke Metallurgical had closed. In 1977, the fleet was assigned as follows:

22 in calcium phosphate service at IMC in Port Maitland. 
7 in ferro manganese service at Union Carbide in Welland for loading to Lasco Steel in Whitby and Stelco in Edmonton. 
28 in superphosphate service at IMC in Port Maitland.
2 for soda ash loading at Allied Chemical in Amherstburg for shipments to Dominion Glass on the Hamilton Belt Line.
1 assigned to temporary service on CP.
8 in dolomite service at Steetley Industrieson the H&D Branch in Dundas.
10 in lime service between Domtar in Beachville and Cyanimid in Niagara Falls. 
3 in feed service at Robin Hood in Port Colborne. 
1 car had been destroyed. 

In 1984, IMC closed their manufacturing facilities in Port Maitland. At that time the assignment of the fleet was as follows :
20 in calcium phosphate service at IMC at Port Maitland.
15 in phosphate service at IMC in Port Maitland. 
1 in soda ash service between Allied Chemical in Amherstburg and Dominion Glass on the Hamilton Belt Line.
27 in superphosphate service at IMC in Port Maitland. 
10 in lime service between Domtar in Beachville and Cyanimid in Niagara Falls.
4 were temporarily assigned to service on CP.
5 in ferro manganese service at Union Carbide in Welland for loading to Lasco Steel in Whitby and Stelco in Edmonton.
1 in dolomite service at Steetley Industries on the H&D Branch in Dundas.
3 were unassigned.
4 had been destroyed. 

By 1986, almost the entire fleet was stored unassigned at Kinnear and Aberdeen. 

That year, the bulk of the fleet was placed into lime service between Beachville and Cyanimid in Niagara Falls.

As this traffic diminished, most of the cars were stored on CP. Account their small size and age, these cars were gradually retired from CP, the last car being scrapped in 1996.

Reply 0
eastwind

words ending in INC

Quote:

So looks like a word ending in INC.

Quote:

 23 in zinc concentrate service 

You can call me EW. Here's my blog index

Reply 0
Jim at BSME

Zinc definetely

Well I don't know why I didn't see the Z before, but if you click on the image from the first comment and click on the magnifying glass to see the image full size you can see the Z between the consolidated stencil and the graffiti heart. It is plain as day to me now, but is that just because I know it is a Z?contents.png 

 

- Jim B.
Baltimore Society of Model Engineers, Estd. 1932
O & HO Scale model railroading
Check out BSME on: FacebookInstagram
Reply 0
mesimpson

Thanks for the assignment information

I've been looking for an excuse to have my lone TH&B slabside show up on occasion in The Pas, Manitoba in the early 1980's, and it looks like I can have it hauling superphosphate and calcium phosphate to the fertilizer dealer.  Thanks for that information.

Marc Simpson 

Reply 0
Reply