My thoughts

I do not think there is a problem of same people inputting to forum. For instance Michael Rose and others that post updates of their work are enjoyable, informative and inspiring. Cross posting may be more of an issue but maybe a better definition of what to post where or ask people to refrain from double post but if someone posts a photo on their blog of updates and the same photo to Weekly Photo thread is that a problem? I do read both but what if someone only reads one or the other, they may miss the very photo that inspires/helps them.

Personally the bigger problem is posts that continue a thread especially when same thoughts are repeated. Possibly if there was a "like" option that would eliminate that.

Great ezine and forum, please keep the good work going.

Long posts

For me personally, I'm not upset by people who post a lot.  But I do think some of the posts are way too long.  If a thread is a conversation, a long post is someone hogging the floor.  What's even worse is when the long post is only one or two paragraphs making it difficult to read and comprehend.  Frankly, I skim or skip over those.  Also, I think some folks get carried away with the pictures - using 5 where 1 will make the point.

I don't know that you the moderator can really do much about this, unless like tweets you can limit the length.  But then like tweets, folks just use multiples.  I suspect the best you can do is to ask folks to be a little considerate.

Paul

Different Strokes

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that I do not mind how often someone posts. I cannot gauge their enthusiasm or commitment to their respective hobby. I understand everyone has things that occupy their time and everyone is as different as the ever present winter storm snowflake. I have seen one line and page length posts, those whom reply often and seldom.

I know Joe F didn't make this page/blog/topic as a general gripe session, but IF I had one complaint, its those posts that start a thread/topic and then have 10 pictures and 12 paragraphs of text. When these posts go beyond the initial page, it becomes a pain to scroll down. Otherwise I enjoy the posts and blogs and the civil demeanor of the participants.

Already cut back...

Hello, my name is Peter and I am a writing addict.

I realized last winter when I had two tutorial threads and a prolonged build documentation going that the forum was seriously cutting into my hobby time. So I cut back, winding up the tutorials and finishing the build. I still read, but I usually only put my two cents worth in where I actually have some experience and expertise. A couple of times, I wrote something extensive for hot threads, but rereading showed that nothing much was really added and I dumped the whole thing. I may post a photo of my current project when it is done, but doing step by step documentation really slows the process. The desire to get to a point where a new post made sense also added some false deadline pressure. My life has been too complex lately for direct comparison, but I seem to get  more done per hobby hour.

Instead, I began lobbying for the wiki, where I can satisfy my urge to spout off teach in a more permanent and thoughtful fashion.

pqe

Let them bloviate.

I can be a cranky old fart, but some time ago I learned that forums are not created solely for me, and that other folks have other preferences. If somebody wants to post repeatedly instead of doing "real modeling," that's his choice. I learn fairly quickly which posters revel in diarrhea of the keyboard, so I usually don't click on their stuff. I also don't need to waste my own and others' time sending e-mails about how this or that post bugs me and I wish it wouldn't happen. 

If lots of us would do the same as I, maybe the Perpetual Posters could learn. Lack of many replies could tell them to lighten up.

Bill MIchael's point about duplicating previous stuff in a thread: I've occasionally been irritated when one of my gems is posted by somebody else as if it's his own. Well, it is his own. The thing is that some people don't read an entire thread before they add their own 3 cents. Or maybe I wrote my thing in such a way that my wisdom was not obvious (this happened recently). I am (still!) learning just to accept duplicate posts; the more people write the same thing, the more likely it is to be worth something.

DrJolS

Lone Modelers?

I get the feeling that maybe "some" frequent posters are "lone wolfs(ves)" - i.e., they maybe don't have any local model railroading communities/clubs/organizations to belong to or socialize with.  Maybe the postings and blogs are their only contact with other modelers.  Not that there is anything wrong with that, just speculating....

For 20 plus years, I hosted a Friday Night work party at my house, every Friday night.  A group of fellow modelers, some of whom did not have their own layout, came over and worked on my layout.  It was a great deal for me, obviously, but more importantly it was a social model railroading outlet for the bunch of us.

Then I moved to a smaller city, population 35K, and, outside of a local NMRA monthly clinic, I'm pretty much a lone wolf.  Not my choice, but not many modelers around (except for my friend Dr. Nick Muff).  So I've come to really enjoy reading the blogs and topics and so forth, following along as others document their builds/layouts.  If I have something to contribute, i.e. answering a "how to" or something, I'll jump in, but for the most part, it is just pleasurable reading for me.  

Al Carter

Interesting Joe..

... that you brought this up. Usually I just skip the posts of the 'overly excited' ramblers. It's kind of easy to spot those who talk just to talk (to me any ways). Lately I have backed away from the forums for that very reason( others I speak with outside here have done the same). I pretty much skim the topics and move on. I also don't want to discourage anyone.. but too much salt ruins the meal... 

"We have received a number of

Did you tell these complainers that this is not a zero sum game. They can post as much as they like no matter how much others post. They don't have to read posts that don't interest them, so problem seems to be that they don't like others posting things they don't agree with?  The key to getting content you like in a discussion group is to post it yourself not complain about what others might be posting........DaveB

Appreciate them...

I really appreciate the frequent posters.  Topics I am not interested in I skip, but without the frequent posters there would not be anywhere near the amount of content on the sitre as there is.  I tend to doubt that infrequent posters are going to suddenly make up the difference if most of the frequent posters stopped posting as much as they do.  It would just be a less valuable site and resource.

That said, I do think features such as Likes or Thank-you's or other ways to just give a thumbs up and not create a new post would be helpful, and might actually increase the feedback posters get, which would then encourage those who post but don't generate a lot of written replies.  NScale.net has a feature like that for saying "Thank you" for posting something without replying and while my own occasional posts don't generate a lot fo replies it encourages me to continue to participate seeing the Thank-you's my posts there get.

-Ed

Is there an issue?

I went back about a week in the recent posts and there were only 23 people who created two or more topics.  There were only three people who created five or more topics (excluding MRH empoyees or systems).  That is out of 104 topics, 62 blog posts and 17 MRH/eZine posts.

How big is this "problem"?  Is it really a problem?

A while back somebody claimed that there as too much of topic A in one of the magazines and they never published anything on topic B.  So I went back a year and looked at all the issues and it turned out there, in reality, had been about the same amount of A and B in the magazine.

Is the "problem" a real thing or a perception?  How many people are we talking about?  My brief research shows only a small number might fall into the frequent poster category (if its really a problem, talk to them).

The next question is, is that bad?  What is the harm if I post on 300 messages and the average user posts on 10?

I think with any forum there is a skewed distribution of participation, based on being on many forums for several years.  There is probably a single digit percentage who are active participants, there are maybe 10-15% who are occasional participants and then the remainder rarely participate or are lurkers.

Finally, if its a problem (and you must at least suspect it is or you wouldn't have brought it up), what are YOU going to do about it.  Its your  forum, you set the rules.  Are you going to set a post limit (you can't post more than 3 times a day or on more than 3 threads a day)?  Are you going to have a post counter by a user's name to see how many posts they make (ends up counter productive, people try to drive up the count)?  Are you going to have moderators warn or suspend people who don't make "quality" posts?  Are you actually going to talk to the frequent posters (since I suspect ist a small group you are talking about) or is this just a "soft" warning to those people hoping just talking about it will encourage them to mend their ways?

Enthusiasm, Innovation, and People

Hi Joe,

Much of my professional career I managed technical projects and groups in highly competitive industries. With product development, particularly engineering groups, fostering innovation was often critical to success -- and it was one of the most fragile things to manage, although I thought group and personal enthusiasm was often more problematic. They are very easy to damage and destroy, and require much continuous attention to maintain, especially in light of expansion and change.

The continuum of MRH media and communication is a blur to many readers, but the MRH forum is the nexus for shared thought, enthusiasm and innovation, regardless of the initial source. Managing a friendly, polite, and thought provoking environment in the context of what may be one of the widest-breadth hobbies on the planet is a tall order. I very much liken these as similar challenges, and the heart of the fundamental challenge/dilemma of which you speak.

The enthusiasm of a person new to the hobby can be incredibly refreshing. But like a strength that is overplayed, it can become a weakness. Stomping on such wild enthusiasm can not only crush the individual but take those in the same context down too. There is a blance that needs to be maintained. The more obvious situations occur when written, short blurbs, often with much emotion and little consideration, are voiced and immediately interpreted in the worst possible way -- we have little way of "hearing the inflection" or "viewing the body language" that might temper such things into humor, rather than exaggerated disdain. And we should remember the number of readers looking on whose primary language is not English (or American!) trying to decipher some sarcastic innuendo on the forum. It is incredible (really) how well the MRH forum operates! I would certainly not like to see a duplicate of Yahoo were some groups are dominated by one or two self asserted "geniuses" who only seem to be grounded in their own reality, nor like the MR forum were every post and video needs to be approved before posting!

The delicate balance in development groups is maintained by public encouragement of those exercising exemplary behavior which bolster the entire group, and quiet, behind the scenes "moderation" of those operating out of nomal bounds. I do not pretend to have been always successful at such, but when you can get groups of enthusiastic, innovative, creative people to combine their efforts-- "magic" things can happen. I have been lucky enough to have seen such and fortunate enough to have been a participant.

In this light, managing this forum is managing people. Do not think otherwise... just one man's opinion.

Good luck and have fun!  
Best regards,
Geoff Bunza

My thoughts (being a frequent poster)

"We have received a number of concerned emails now about how a small percentage of modelers seem to be monopolizing our forums and blogs. It's not unlike what happens in a group discussion when one or two people monopolize the conversation."

What does it mean to monopolize?  According to the Webster online dictionary: "to take over and control (something or someone) completely : to use (something) in a way that prevents others from using it". While having a number of frequent posters can be intimidating to less frequent posters I don't see how frequent posters posting can "prevent others from using it".

Online mediums (web postings) aren't like personal conversations where the well mannered won't interrupt the speaker and thus the speaker can monopolize the conversation.  Here we can "all talk at once" and the readers can choose what they want to read (as others have noted here on this thread).  If you look at the MRH magazine (and most any other magazine) most of the articles (not written by staff) are written by only a few people.  Should we then resist including articles by frequent contributors like Lance Mindheim?  This could be a slippery slope!

I admit that I'm a frequent poster to the MRH forum and have submitted (and had published) a number of articles in the MRH magazine.  Yes, I sometime "go one" about something on this forum; however, nobody has to read it nor feel intimidated by me.

Free and open forum

Nobody puts a gun to my head to read or post anything. This forum has been very helpful and informative with my model railroading exploits. I enjoyed reading all the NMRA bashing because there was some truth there but along with politics there is no place in this forum for that just keep it to model railroading and Thank you to everyone who takes the time to post!

We agree

We agree. I'm beginning to think there is a right way and a not-as-good way to handle frequent posters.

I like how Mike Rose handles his frequent posts -- he has created a blog and he's constantly posting to it. Seeing his blog constantly on the first page of recent posts is great because he gets constant traffic. However, his blog is just one long thread so it doesn't feel like he's monopolizing anything.

There are others like Deemiorgos (not picking on you D, just pointing out the different approach and how it affects this site) who probably posts as much as Mike does, but because he's using individual forum threads for each post, it looks like he's taking over -- up to a third of the posts on the recent posts first page belong to him at times. I bet Deemiorgos isn't posting much more often than Mike Rose, but it sure feels like it!

My thinking is to ask Deemiorgos and other zealous posters to move to a big long blog thread like Mike Rose. Then they can post all they want and we can all respond all we want, but they won't monopolize the first page of recent posts. However, their blog threads will constantly be on page 1, which is fine because it now only takes ONE line on recent posts.

Keep in mind threads about what YOU are doing should be a blog rather than a forum. A forum thread is supposed to be more "let's all talk about this" topics and not your personal journal.

That somehow seems more "fair" to allow other eager modelers to get their threads back on page 1 too, and not give any one person a lion's share of the first recent posts page real estate.

I found it interesting that

@Joe Longer Pages?

Hi Joe,

Have fun! 

I'm glad you raised this,

I'm glad you raised this, Al.

I live in an area with only one club and they have their meets once a month on the evening I work. I know only two model railroaders personally, but they have no time outside of work to spend visiting folk such as myself due to family commitments, mortgages, and the great distances between us. My local hobby shop is no place to socialize, as most of the staff are pretentious snobs and love to point out the innocent ignorance of other model railroaders and potential new model railroaders in regards to train stuff. If lucky, I get to go to the annual train hobby show if I can get the day off work. My only contact with other model railroaders is on this forum. I would love to have someone visit my layout and have a session with them, but no one has the time especially the young crowd that work at one or two jobs with longs hours just to get by in order to deal with the local housing shortage. So the only way I can have someone visit my layout is on the net. I'm grateful for the opportunity to share my work. experience, and folk to correspond with on this site.

 "Are you going to set a post

LOL , so someone could be stuck waiting for an answer to their question because everyone has used up their daily posting quota. Maybe we should return to writing a letter to a magazine then waiting 6 months for them to publish an answer :> )   I think this whole thing is getting blown out of proportion and if left alone will solve it's self, posters come and go and interest and enthusiasm waxes and wanes  ......DaveB  

I'm glad you brought this up,

I'm glad you brought this up, Joe.

I tend to be all over the place so to speak and haven't figured out a way to focus, as so many aspects can come out of one project.

I'm not a forum savvy person, but do need some guidance as to how to do blogs and threads. One of the things I do is go back to a post only to correct an error I made or to replace an image, which puts the post back at the top of the page.

Anyhow, look forward to continuing suggestions.

I had to check the date. To

I had to check the date. To make sure it wasn't 1st of April, after reading this  subject post.

So now are people going to be thinking .hmmm should I post this, or would it be seen as "posting too much". I would rather have people post as much as possible. Keeps the forums alive. Nobody is forcing anyone to read every single post. 

Unless bringing up this issue, to highlight another issue? Space constraints on the server perhaps?

So going forward. I will limit the amount I post and reply to, just to make sure im not "over posting"

Warm regards

Phil

Do not see the problem

If you think someone post too much, do not read the post aka skip it, or go someplace else to post.  Yes, MRH has it's basket full of sheep and yes man, so?  almost 98.95% of the time I know a select few of the members will post on everything.  Fully reading the post or not but we get the 2 cents from them, again  So?

As an early huge fan of MRH from it's inception, my enthusiasm has pretty much hit the zero level for MRH.  So the odds of me posting are next to zero (Yes, I hear the Cheering)  I know and still chat with about a dozen former user s of MRH that no longer post on MRH, so I did gain some connections do to MRH.  I do have a few people I know that only lurk on MRH and never post.  He e-mails me and ask if I will post any updates on what I'm doing.  So at that point I post a few photos of the layout, house, train room etc. and what I'm working on.  Then chat back and forth via e-mail. (Some people do not like Messenger, Facebook, or public forums etc.)

Granted, I'm one of the people most regular MRH users wish would go away,  so I have no real stick in this fire.  Some people add value and some people do not.  I have discovered I'm on the do not add value side in the case of MRH so I no longer post about my layout or projects unless I'm asked.  I now spend most my time in other model railroad outlets that are a little more open and less critical or clicky.

So in the end why does it matter if someone post too much or not at all.  Some one cared that much to complain.  That seems to be why a few people left MRH in the past too much complaing.

Not limiting posts -- changing how posting is done

No, that's not the spirit of this thread. If I was to describe it more precisely, it's how to better manage the recent posts first couple pages.

Blog vs Topic vs ?

One author happens to post multiple topics of interest that keep popping up on the first page , so what is the issue? 

Thank you to all who post, wish I could post more.

BTW:Has the Last update time of the last post on the first page been increasing recently?

Eugene

I've been guilty

of posting too many pictures on my first post and Joe was nice enough to suggest that I keep the initial post short and then immediately "comment" to add additional material.  This is a good idea as it make navigating posts much easier.

I've also added and "index" of sorts to my continuing threads which contains the page number of additions and even a link so readers can easily jump to they page that they desire.  It's a little more work but I believe that it's worth it - especially on long posts / blogs that have many pages.