jfmcnab

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Over the holiday week I tore down the two peninsula valances on my IAIS Grimes Line layout and put up wrapped fluorescent fixtures in the middle of the basement. When construction began 2 1/2 years ago, my lighting design was simple. Lots of it and cheap. I went with tried and true fluorescent lights behind a hardboard valance. The result was even, focused light on the layout.

In the time since I made that decision it began to bother me. Our home will celebrate its centennial in 7 years and our basement suffers from the effects of its age, namely a low ceiling and a hodgepodge of wiring, pipes, and ducts run thru the basement from a century of occupancy. Our basement features a large return duct in the southeast corner over the layout. Since I wanted a continuous valance with a consistent viewing "portal" for the layout, the combination of the large duct and the low ceiling led to a 12 inch wide valance with a 12 in opening between it and the fascia.

The Grimes and Clive peninsulas (see track plan here) are open on both sides for ease of operation. There isn't a backdrop for both areas, but there was a full valance wrapping around each peninsula. The result was a giant green box floating over each area. Since each peninsula is 16 inches deep, the low valance was making construction and maintenance difficult. While it did focus the light on the layout, it left the rest of the room in darkness, turning my layout space into a cave.

The valanced-light remains around the perimeter. The result is even lighting throughout the room and a much more open feel. Yes, it's not as focused as it was with the valances, but the overall effect is a much more inviting and relaxing space.

James

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arthurhouston

Never Enough Light

This looks great, a lesson i learned over many years. It becomes more important as you get older. Its not how pretty its is, it is weather you can see it.

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doc-in-ct

Surface Mouth LED Strips?

Have you considered strips of SMD LEDs?  There is another thread where these are discussed: https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/a-new-era-in-layout-lighting-12191530

Alan T.
Co-Owner of the CT River Valley RR - a contemporary HO scale layout of Western & Northern CT, and Western Mass.  In the design stage; Waterbury CT.

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jfmcnab

Lighting Design

The SMD LED thread has been an interesting read. But for now I'm going to stick with the lighting I (now) have. The main goal was to open up the center of the room by removing the large valance over the peninsulas.

James

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Steam Donkey

"Before" Photo?

Hi James,

In addition to some top notch modeling, you're doing a fantastic job with the overall look of the train room, something I believe to be essential to the general comfort of the operators and modelers.

I've just moved into a new house and am working on a new layout design including a couple of small peninsulas. I'm debating weather or not to have a valence over top of the peninsulas, but after seeing your photo above I may not bother with one. Do you happen to have a "before" photo showing the peninsula valance?

Stan

 

 

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jfmcnab

Before

Ask and receive...

1lamp.jpg 

James

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michaelrose55

I'm sorry but I like the

I'm sorry but I like the 'before' better. But as they say it's your railroad and it has to make YOU happy, not me !

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jfmcnab

Choices

To each their own Michael. I ended up with a better lit and more open and inviting space.

James

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BNstringfellow

You did a great job with the

You did a great job with the lighting either way you did it. I really like how clean and simple your room looks. It effectively directs yours eyes to the layout, not everything else. I really like the look of you fascia, although I can't really tell what color it is. What is it?

 

link to my blog: http://bnnelsonsub.blogspot.com/

Modeling Burlington Northern railroad's Nelson Subdivision in 1981

David Stringfellow

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jfmcnab

CTC Green

Fascia was painted with the world-famous "CTC Green", based on Devoe Paint's Upland Green and popularized by David Barrow and his Cat Mountain & Santa Fe railroad. It's an olive-green mix that resembles the color used on a US&S Centralized Traffic Control Machine, hence the name.

ascia(1).jpg 

James

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kleaverjr

It is all a matter of preference....

I agree with Michael, I prefer the way it was, but hey, it's your basement, you will be spending the most time down there, that is the only factor that matters.  Well, that and the fire code.

The issue becomes what happens when you are in a Club situation, then the situation can get rather tense.  I only have one good eye, so for me, where there is a "normal" level of light for most people, I consider it dark, so I always want more light.  Fortunately we were able to come up with a compromise where the lighting wasn't recreating the sun, on the other hand, there is sufficient light so I can see and enjoy working and operating on the layout.  I still would prefer it brighter than it is, however, it's tolerable. 

Question:  Do you plan on finishing the ceiling somehow to cover up the ductwork and such.  I guess I am very anal retentive when it comes to room esthetics because when visiting layouts, even those of some of the more famous model railroaders, if I see ductwork and such, even if painted sky blue and such, I find it detracts from the overall scene.  The argument that the "trains are the focal point" has validity for most people, but I can't explain why, but my eye is literally drawn to such things.  I have spent thousands of dollars to relocate various utility pieces (such as the ductwork) so it is concealed and otherwise not seen at all.  A waste of money? For most, that is very likely the case.  And I may be the only Model Railroader on earth that worries about such things. 

FWIW.

Ken L

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Bill Brillinger

nope.

Quote:

I may be the only Model Railroader on earth that worries about such things.

You're not alone Ken.

Bill Brillinger

Modeling the BNML in HO Scale, Admin for the RailPro User Group, and owner of Precision Design Co.

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jfmcnab

Presentation

Neither are you Bill!

I believe that how you present something is just as important as what you present. Which is why spent time and money to include additional touches, including trim pieces on all the corners, legs, and along the bottom of the fascia and valance. I've always been a fan of the "MIlwaukee-style" of presentation, which is why (up until this past Thursday) I installed a full valance over the entire layout.

I would love to finish or cover the ceiling to hide all the ductwork, pipes, and wires. Compared to some of the layout spaces I've been to or seen on here mine is a glorified pit. The removal of the peninsula valances for general fluorescent fixtures has literally "shined a light" on formerly dark areas that were hidden from plain sight.

However at this time it's not in the cards to completely finish the basement/layout space, just as it wasn't feasible three years ago when construction began. I chose to live with the less than stellar space as a trade-off towards building the layout.

The alternative would have been no Grimes Line at all, and that wasn't an option!

Best,
James

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Bill Brillinger

For the record....

I think your layout & presentation is top notch James. Keep it up. (regardless of what might be over your head!)

Bill Brillinger

Modeling the BNML in HO Scale, Admin for the RailPro User Group, and owner of Precision Design Co.

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rrfaniowa

Overhead concerns

Compared to some of the layout spaces I've been to or seen on here mine is a glorified pit. 

Don’t worry, James. I can tell you from my experience in your layout room that I spent about a nanosecond looking at the floor joists. The rest of the time I was mesmerized by your wonderful layout. 

But, I can relate to your concern as the layout builder as I am in the midst of my own “overhead” worries as I get the layout under construction.

Scott Thornton

Scott Thornton

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ctxmf74

I would love to finish or cover the ceiling to hide all the duct

How about some of those plastic panels that cover ceiling lights? Maybe the lights could be framed with drop ceiling metal grid and flush frosted covers added? ......DaveB

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Bill Brillinger

Plastic Panels

It looks to me like these lights do have snap in 3 sided plastic panels.

I would consider adding a masonite shroud around each light to block the sides. Like a mini valance, just enough to eliminate the edge light. This could be cut from the old valance materials.

Bill Brillinger

Modeling the BNML in HO Scale, Admin for the RailPro User Group, and owner of Precision Design Co.

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jfmcnab

Valance vs Valance

Quote:

It looks to me like these lights do have snap in 3 sided plastic panels.

Correct. Diffusers are already built in. It's a lot of light on a low ceiling, hence the glare in the photo.

I'm going to pass on adding any kind of valance back to the lights for now. If I were to do anything, it would be to cover the ceiling in the middle of the room.

James

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ctxmf74

"Diffusers are already built in"

   I was thinking of flat plastic panels that fit into drop ceiling grids then you could have the flush lights with solid panels placed between them......DaveB

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Jackh

Faded Scenery Colors?

I am in the midst of looking at lighting options too. At the moment I have 3 shop light type fluorescent fixtures and what little scenery I have in place has faded. In photos it comes out grey. Is it the bulbs, or the type of fixtures? Or does it take a special kind of cover?

As far a ceiling covering goes a lot of times it depends on how much room you have to put in a ceiling. When it is full of pipes, wiring, and ductwork a modeler can spend 1000s covering it all up, and a year or more taking the time to do the work. Some things you are aware of right off and then they turn invisible and are not seen again until they need to be seen.

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ctxmf74

"a modeler can spend 1000s covering it all up"

I recently framed in some new walls to make a portion of my workshop into a train room.It's an L shaped room about 28 feet on both long legs by 10 feet wide. Since I'm not sure how long I'll stay here I put up white plastic tarps for a ceiling  to keep the dust out. The local Orchard supply hardware had them on sale for half price so I just stretched them and stapled thin wooden battens to hold them tight. I re-hung the  fluorescent shop  lights from the joists below the tarps , the whole job only took a few hours and it seems to work fine......DaveB

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CM Auditor

Stop the Color Fade

Most museums will use individual UV filters around each of the florescent tubes.  They will reduce the fading of model railroad colors.

CM Auditor

Tom VanWormer

Monument CO

Colorado City Yard Limits 1895

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jfmcnab

Faux Ceilings

Quote:

Since I'm not sure how long I'll stay here I put up white plastic tarps for a ceiling  to keep the dust out. The local Orchard supply hardware had them on sale for half price so I just stretched them and stapled thin wooden battens to hold them tight.

Any photos of your setup you could share?

James

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Muskoka Steve

Lighting Choices

I just had to light a new shelf section of my layout.  For this section I used T-5 single bulb fluorescent fixtures with 4100K Bulbs.  The bulb light Temperature is very important.  The 3000K bulbs, typically called Warm White are too dim and yellow.  The 6000K bulbs, often labeled at "Daylight" are too blue.

 

The front part of the picture is not lit directly by the fluorescent fixtures, that's why it is a little dimmer.

In other areas of my layout, I use a lot of GU10 bulbs in track lighting.  The center peninsula has a few Par50 bulbs on it plus some additional GU10 track lights pointing down on it.  The shelves off to the sides have GU10 bulbs pointed at them.  The shelf at the back has fluorescent fixtures behind the valance as well as a few recessed fixtures.  If you keep the lighting sources close together, you won't get any gaps or hot spots along the backdrop.  With the track lighting, you need a lot of them or it's impossible not to get hot spots. 

I replaced all the regular GU10 bulbs with Dimmable LED bulbs.  At $25 each, this was an expensive endeavor, but regular bulbs got way too hot and with so many around the layout, they really heated up the space, and used a lot more energy.  These LED bulbs only use 7W each vs. 50Watts for the regular bulbs.

Under the shelf are a series of 24" display lighting.  These are like high quality under cabinet fluorescent fixtures.  They are T5 bulbs as well.  The T5 bulbs are very thin and can be hidden behind a valance that is only about 4" wide.

complete.jpg 

This is a wide shot of the new shelf expansion around the TV viewing area.

Steve J

Muskoka Central RR

Cambridge, ON

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ctxmf74

"Any photos of your setup you could share?"

ceiling.jpg Here's a section of the plastic tarp ceiling. Still needs a couple of fluorescent shop lights along the right side, already have some along the left side of the room.  Some light is shining thru the tarp from shop lights in the workshop beyond the wall..DaveB

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