Mike Rosenberg

I'm a widower (with all grown children) who will be moving someday.  Eventually, I hope to build a fairly substantial permanent railroad that balances passenger and freight service in the heavily traveled Northeast region.  This is my second attempt to get back into model railroading after decades of absence.  (First effort was a port-themed section of the larger vision designed professionally.  It's beautiful and has everything I wanted, but it's run into "complications" beyond my or the designer's controls and has been started, but has been on hold for over a year.)

Meanwhile, I've started building structure kits (almost as fast as I've been buying structure kits) and I need some place more interesting than under a sheet of plastic on the table to put them, so I'm starting a second module I know can be finished without any of the "complications."

Enough background.  Your mission should you choose to accept it:  critique the attached layout, given the following information.

Scale: N scale

Size: 18' x 8', built on three 8' x 2' modules in an L shape that can be separated for relocation.  Two modules are already framed - 1/2' foam on 3/8" plywood (as base for attaching tortoise switch machines) over 1"x 4" framing. Right now, they will be freestanding, taking up much of the family room (that's one benefit of being a widower - not having to negotiate for space), with access from the lower side of the layout. I'm considering a masonite or linoleum backdrop on the top and right sides - al least until I relocate, but permanent if I like it.)

Envisioned/imagined situation:

While the layout is proto-lanced, it helps to think of this module as being New York City area.  There's a two track main (dark track in attached plan) running down "the canyon", around the yard and behind the intermodel terminal.  During rush hours, the main is clogged with commuter service heading west (leftwards) into the city in the morning and eastward in the evenings.  In between there will be inter-city and off-peak commuter service, as well as unit and manifest freight service. This area is served by one manifest freight that arrives before the morning rush hour (and leaves after picking up outbound traffic since it leaves running against traffic) and two intermodal trains running overnight service between Boston and Washington/Baltimore, with intermediate stops here and in Philadelphia.  The south/westbound train arrives at 10 PM and the North/eastbound one at 2 AM.

This location is served by two locally-based switchers.  Because of main line traffic in the area, crossing the main to handle the north side industries should be limited to once in each direction during the day and (if necessary) once at night.  The daytime dispatcher gets cranky otherwise....

Design:

Standard track components (Peco Code 55), DCC operation, 7 mainline switches (crossovers and entries to yard and North side)  will be "dispatcher controlled" (DCC by operators at the moment), others will be operated from local control panels. Uncoupling by fixed and electromagnetic magnets, with some assistance from Rixpix (more likely kebab skewers).

Minimum radius on main is 24"; 18" on entrance to intermodal terminal (I couldn't figure a way to make it larger). Switches are all Peco code 55 medium length electro-frog.

Left most module is "the canyon", ending at the double overpass (I know, it looks like a grade crossing, but it's a double overpass which disguises the crack between modules.  Most industries are stock kits.  There's a bit of kit-bashing and one large complex (GE) that will be made from Walthers modulars with some custom cutting).

Middle section is yard in front, with "energy center" (Goldenflame Coal and Interstate Fuel with supplemental fuel tanks) and Medusa cement on north side.

Right-most section is the intermodal yard, with three pairs of tracks - for Boston, Philadelphia and Washington/Baltimore traffic, respectively.

Comments? Advice?  I can use plenty of both.  I have far less knowledge of what I'm doing than I think I have and that's dangerous...

Mike

Reply 0
kerrydel

One suggestion

One thing that I see right off the bat, is that there is no way to get into the yard when coming from the lower right.  You can only back in.  I would suggest you swap the 2 switches (near the 15" dimension) so that you can enter the yard from this direction as well.

Kerry

 

Reply 0
David Husman dave1905

Suggestions

Add another connection to the lead at the top so you don't have to switch back into the lead. 

Move the crossover on the left end of the yard to the left side of the lead switch so you can head into the yard.

The intermodal yard says you are modeling the 1990's or later because its a ramp, but the stub end tracks cry out 1970's.  The design is more typical of an auto ramp than an intermodal ramp.  An intermodal ramp would have longer tracks that are double ended and connected to the main track so a train can drive straight in and straight out.  They don't really have the "classifications" like a class yard since the cars are loaded in block so there isn't switching.  When it comes time to build the Chicago train, they spot empty wells and load Chicago cans in the them. Cans aren't loaded when they are recieved they are loaded when the train runs.  Inbound cans, the blocking doesn't matter, they will all be unloaded anyway.

 

Dave Husman

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Reply 0
Greg Amer gregamer

I really like it. It looks

I really like it. It looks like your switching leads are plenty long.

I'd move the Brach's spur to the right to leave more switching space on the siding.

I'd add a second crossover to the main further down the left side switching lead.

I think your Intermodal yard is fine. It reminds me of BNSF Seattle International Gateway North Yard

http://maps.google.com/?ll=47.584472,-122.335945&spn=0.00173,0.003551&t=h&vpsrc=6&z=18

it's a six track stub ender that is serviced by container cranes built in 2008.

 

Greg

Reply 0
Artarms

n scale switching

As a recent convert to n scale I am  happy to report switching is as easy as in the larger scales.  There are locomotives available (not all of them) with excellent slow speed control and the mag knuckle couplers work as well or better than in larger scales. (Manual uncoupling with skewers - no experience with track magnet )

One caution is access.  You have six tracks in a space between buildings just over six inches - this may be difficult to work if you need hands-on.  It will also be a problem in your brick-alley.  Finally, you will need to reach over the near-side buildings to reach the trains.  You might need to modify some buildings to make this easier.

As a man with grown children you may feel, as I do, the onset of age-related physical restrictions.  When a car is derailed I cannot rerail in on the spot.  The wheel flanges are small and, when  looking down on the train,  I can't see the wheels on the track.  I need a portable plastic rerailer which requires more access.

There is no loss of fun and challenge in constructing and operating.  Good luck - please send photos of your progress  you have an interesting layout for both operation and construction. 

Art

 

Reply 0
Mike Rosenberg

Revisions

(see attachment for revisions)

 

Kerry:

Quote:

One thing that I see right off the bat, is that there is no way to get into the yard when coming from the lower right.  You can only back in.  I would suggest you swap the 2 switches (near the 15" dimension) so that you can enter the yard from this direction as well.

I think I drew in the change you suggested (in red box at right on attachment), but I'm not sure I agree.  I marked the A/D track to help explain why.  There is (was - in the original) a direct line into the A/D track that didn't interfere with working the local storage tracks.  With only three trains (and, perhaps a 4th) per day I need only one A/D track.  After all, this is a local storage yard, not a major classification yard.

Of course, the interference on the east lead really doesn't exist either, since the yard is really set up to be switched from the west (left) end -- even for the intermodal traffic.


Dave:

Quote:

Add another connection to the lead at the top so you don't have to switch back into the lead. 

Move the crossover on the left end of the yard to the left side of the lead switch so you can head into the yard.

I'm not sure I understand these.  At the "top" (west end), there is a "straight shot" from both the A/D track and the yard's storage tracks to the mains (dark lines)in both directions.

Quote:

The intermodal yard says you are modeling the 1990's or later because its a ramp, but the stub end tracks cry out 1970's.  The design is more typical of an auto ramp than an intermodal ramp.  An intermodal ramp would have longer tracks that are double ended and connected to the main track so a train can drive straight in and straight out.  They don't really have the "classifications" like a class yard since the cars are loaded in block so there isn't switching.

I'd love to have the space to run 20-40 spine cars through as a unit, but I just don't have the space and it probably isn't appropriate give the scenario - this is an urban intermodal yard that collects cars for three specific destinations that are specifically attached to two overnight trains.  The yard is primarily for storage/overflow and serves both the intermodal terminal and as drop-off/storage for local industries.

My vision is that, to expedite the drop off and pick up of cars, the westbound intermodal 6to6 service (from "Boston") uses the head end equipment to pull the cars destined for here ("New York") from the head end and then pulls the cars destined for the next stop (Philadelphia) from the yard storage track back to the head end of the train (where the Philly-bound cars from Boston will be).  Meanwhile, the locally based switcher, working from the east end of the yard, pulls the Baltimore/Washington cars from the storage tracks and tacks them on the rear (east) end of the train (where the DC-bound cars from Boston are).

The east bound train has it easier..... The trains head end equipment pulls the New York cars from the head (east) end of the train while the local switcher loads the Boston cars on the tail end (not that it matters which end they are loaded on, since, by the time the eastbound train reaches New York, all continuing cars are Boston bound).

(Of course, since I'm not modeling Boston or Philadelphia - even when I get to a "permanent" layout stage, that's the scenario, reality is that with a 10' train length, The best I can handle is about 24 units (plus 2 locos) - and, if I'm adding some mix of units here that can be 3/4 of that number, the through traffic is going to be represented by a very short consist....

 

I'm not sure to what you are referring when you mention ramps.  There are none.  True, it's a stub-ended yard, but all loading is done by Mi-Jacks (the yellow squares), assisted by ReachStackers. The space at the bottom of the intermodal yard, beyond what is needed for tractor-hauled traffic, is for storage of bogies and any unclaimed containers.

(Greg posted a Google maps to an actual such terminal, but there are a number of port terminals that also use stub-ended intermodal yards: Here's one of those: http://maps.google.com/maps?q=elizabeth,+nj&hl=en&ll=40.667887,-74.14748&spn=0.005867,0.009001&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=49.757664,73.740234&vpsrc=6&hnear=Elizabeth,+Union,+New+Jersey&t=h&z=17.) 

Quote:

 Cans aren't loaded when they are received they are loaded when the train runs.

Remember, this isn't a standard operation.

The idea is a (non-existant in prototype, but I'd like to think mainly because the real runs are too long) overnight express service from Boston to the greater DC area that relieves I-95 traffic and saves fuel and trucker labor costs, with two intermediate stops in New YorK and Philadelphia, and how Conrail (then, now CSX) would handle it.  While there's certainly storage space in the yard for containers or trailers waiting to be loaded or picked up, the idea is that, to expedite loading on a tight schedule, the cars are loaded as the tractors arrive at the yard and blocks built as spine cars are filled.


Greg:

Quote:

I'd move the Brach's spur to the right to leave more switching space on the siding.

As in red box at top?  I agree. 

Quote:

I'd add a second crossover to the main further down the left side switching lead.

Not sure if the second change (long red multi-sided area on top, belows Brach's revision) is quite what you meant, but say it is because I really like it, since it prevents a change of direction on the main to get to the north side....


Thanks to all of you.  More comments are still welcome. Roadbed starts to go down in December (soon as I finish  oak tag mock-up of kits I haven't build), so now's the time to save from myself....

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Mike

Reply 0
Mike Rosenberg

Re: One caution is access.  You

Quote:


One caution is access.  You have six tracks in a space between buildings just over six inches - this may be difficult to work if you need hands-on. 

That one worries me a bit.  In the end, I came down on the side of throwing caution to the wind because, outside of the yard area, there are are very few spots when adjacent tracks are actually likely to be occupied simultaneously.  In most cases, only the yard tracks will have adjacent tracks occupied for any period of time. The other tracks are usually the main or runaround tracks.

The yard is a horse of a different color, of course.  I don't have the experience to know how often derailments in the yard will be a problem, so I can't measure the trade-offs.  Right now, my plan is to keep a record.... First time a car derails in the yard all is forgiven.  Second time and the car gets smashed against the stone mantle on the fireplace on the other side of the room   (okay, I'm kidding on that part.... I think....)

Quote:

Finally, you will need to reach over the near-side buildings to reach the trains.  You might need to modify some buildings to make this easier.

That's why I set the table leg height at 42" (figure rail height at about 43", with 3/8" plywood and 1/2" Styrofoam, plus sheet cork to keep descending from mains to yards/sidings too abrupt).  Besides, with Geo.Roberts Printing and Hardwood Furniture having (theoretical) unswitching points within the buildings, reaching over buildings is a piece of cake. (For the record, yes, I know the cars will be uncoupled and then pushed in the delayed position).

(Added by Edit: I've marked the approximate uncoupler locations with P's and E's on  this copy of layout.  Note that, where possible, they are actually in front of driveways rather than buildings.  The only problem location is the one in front of the Sterling Consolidated Dairy Office/Warehouse Building.  Even without the permanent uncouplers, all of the other locations should be visible and accessible for RixPix/skewer uncoupling.)

If I'm wrong about something, please tell me now.  It's a lot easier to make changes (even major ones) now than it is to apologize for being a know-it-all who knew nothing, later.

Quote:

As a man with grown children you may feel, as I do, the onset of age-related physical restrictions.

Outside of being near-blind, arthritic and cranky as the dickens, I have no idea whereof you speak.....

Actually, I'm fairly lucky when it comes to being of an age eligible for Medicare and even more attractive to AARP.  As long as I can remember where I left the layout, never mind the rerailer, age has not been a problem.

(Serious answer judging by the experience of building structure kits: either age is not an impediment at this point or age-induced senility has caused me to believe age is not an impediment.  The outcome is the same.)

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Mike

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