Mathejc1

I've seen layouts where multiple tracks terminate (dead end) at a major station, often under a train shed.  I'd like to model this.  However, in studying at least one such track plan, it appears that a train pulls into the station tracks with no provision for turning around the engines.  Operationally, are such trains supposed to back out of the station to the main line?  Or, are they supposed to back into the station?  What am I missing in terms of operating such a passenger configuration?  Any help is greatly appreciated!

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Juxen

St. Louis Union Station

I know that at STL's Union Station (40 stub-ended tracks), the trains would always back into the station. There were a few instances (like the Rexall train) that had the locomotive leading into the station, but that was far and few. Backing in kept passengers away from the steam/diesel exhaust, and allowed the passengers to remain closer to the station building, keeping them out of the way of the baggage handlers and RPO agents.

Amtrak still does this to this day in some stations like Denver.

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Yaron Bandell ybandell

Stub end stations

Some stations have an overtake track between 2 tracks on a platform such that the locomotive can escape to the (former) rear of the train, re-attach and head out the station with locomotive in front.

Some use switchers to pull the cars from the locomotive, run them around a loop track (or wye), get the cars serviced and put back at the stub end station for departure. Locomotive meanwhile has escaped, been serviced and run back in front of the now turned train.

Some trains are used in push-pull configuration with a car at the rear that has a full cabin / control stand. Or with two locomotives book-ending a bunch of passenger cars.

It all depends on a) space, andb) needed turn around time of a train.

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Grenzer47

It depends

At most stub end stations the trains head in engine first and also head out engine first. This is the case in most stub ended depots are the originating/terminating Station. All the Chicago depots operated this way. So did Reading Terminal and Broad Street Station in Philadelphia, Grand Central in New York, North and South Stations in Boston, New Orleans , Los Angeles, Duluth, MN, Union Station in Memphis and countless others. 

Having said that, the Milwaukee Road Station in Minneapolis had some exceptions. Soo line trains, traveling through Minneapolis, headed in and backed out westbound and backed in and headed out eastward. The Milwaukee Road’s Olympian Hiawatha and Colombian, being through trains backed in eastbound and westbound and headed out engine first.

Having said that, many depots in the South we’re stub stations ,such as Raleigh and Chattanooga were backed into and headed out of. You’d pretty much need a wye to handle through trains, but that's ok as such wyes provide lots of action in a small area.

So it’s kind of up to you, depending on the type of operation you’re planning.

Barry P

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David Husman dave1905

Reading Terminal

Stub end terminals many times were built on a wye, trains would back in and pull out (or vice versa).  Backing in put the smokey engines closer to the open end of the shed.

Reading Terminal was not on a wye, the trains would pull in, then a switcher would pull the train off the engines and the engines would go to the engine facilities to have the power turned.  Meanwhile the switcher would switch the train to depart being pulled.

If you put a terminal in a compact urban area you can really compress things into compact shapes.  For example you could make an engine terminal that fit into a long narrow space instead of the traditional big "round" space.  Something like this could work for an urban terminal:

minal(1).png 

Dave Husman

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Mathejc1

City passenger terminus; dead end tracks under train shed

Thanks to all who have responded.  I appreciate the ideas and advice.  I'll give this some thought and fiddle some more with my Any Rail design.

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dwtrains

South Station - Boston

Amtrack and commuter trains pull into dead end tracks at Boston's South Station, engine first.

After passenger dis-embarkment, the train is backed out of the station for servicing and is turned on a wye. The train then backs into the station for it's next departure.

 

 

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WJLI26

Washington Terminal

Washington DC was somewhat different, the upper level, used by the B&O and the Pennsylvania was stub ended. The lower level consisted of through tracks used by the Southern Tenant railroads, (C&O, Southern, RF&P). as well as the PRR connections from New York.

On the Upper level, PRR trains pulled in, and the power waited for the yard engine to pull back the train before proceeding to the engine pit. The B&O backed their trains in both when arriving from (Jersey City), Baltimore, and from the west.That was so the continuation of the train could pull out and proceed.

The B&O also operated Budd RDCs which had cabs on both ends, and the PRR likewise operated electric MUs which had cabs on both ends.

Joe

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Bob_A

Windsor Station Montreal

Working from a foggy memory, Windsor Station (CPR) back in the late 60s early 70s.  The train sheds per se were on the west side of the main station building which also served as the corporate headquarters.  The station was supported by a nearby coach yard in the area of Westmount, a short distance to the west, or an area just to the south west.  Checking a 1985 Time Table, that may have been Glen Yard.  Full disclosure, passenger operations (let alone any operations) was not something I studied as a teenager.  Steam pipes were located at the station end of each track for outbound trains prior to loading.

Outbound trains were  positioned at the station with their back to the station wall and the engines at the west end.  On boarding we walked down the platform and climbed onto the appropriate car.  On departure it was out through Westmount to Montreal West.  Past Montreal West southbound and eastbound trains would take the appropriate divergence while west bound train would continue on to Dorval and then off the island.

Inbound trains drove into the station engine first which gave you a chance for a last look at what had been pulling you.  I image that they then backed out to the coach yard to be broken down for servicing.

Commuter trains for the west island tended to be Budd RDCs so it was a simple in and out for them.  In the evening they were held off the island at their end station in preparation for the morning run.  In later years they were bilevels with a cab car at the end.  I don't recall which end the engines were on.  

I believe that CN's Central Station worked the same way.  Certainly in the 80s and 90s VIA trains drove in and departures were positioned in most cases with the engine out.  There were the occasional exceptions and I do recall a departure one night where I feared we were heading for Ville Quebec rather than Ottawa before realizing that we were simply turning on the wye.  

Trust this helps.

Bob

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Chris Palermo patentwriter

Caltrain San Francisco 4th &Townsend

The station is stub ended and always has been. Push-pull service is used with locomotives facing southbound. Trains depart SF southbound with the locomotive in the lead. The last car is a control cab car. At San Jose, Tamien, or Gilroy, trains terminate, crews move to the control car, and trains run northbound with the locomotive trailing. The cab car ties up at SF just a few feet from the track bumper.

At Large North America Director, 2024-2027 - National Model Railroad Association, Inc.
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