edfhinton

I realize this question is probably one of taste, and potentially prone to differences of opinion, but I can't grow my own thought processes without hearing from others, so here is my question.

On my NNE Scenic design (and prior versions), I want to avoid as much as I can having long stretches between towns being straight track parallel to the layout edge.  But I am torn between angled/long very gently curving sections versus more undulating type sections.  I am in N scale with minimum 18" radius curves (most over 20" and some much broader), so that should be considered in the distances I mention,

My current design tends on long straight sections of benchwork typically 10+ feet between towns to either remain more or less straight but angled either away from or towards the backdrop or else in most cases a single very gradual curve (radius anywhere from 57" to 500"+) creating a gradual track angle change along either much or all of the length of the straight benchwork.  But I have seen some designs that take a much more undulating approach where it is almost all curved track between locations even when along a long straight section of benchwork. Railroad location is New Hampshire so there will be lots of trees, some small farms, some streams and lakes, etc., along many of the stretches between towns/stops

What are folks thoughts/tastes/preferences on mostly undulating curves versus very gradual slow single curve or long angle on straight sections between locations in a wooded and field-dotted countryside? I am interested from the vantage points of both rail-fanning and operations

Thanks,

-Ed

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Proprietor - Northern New England Scenic (V3). N scale NH B&M Eastern and western coastal routes in the mid-1950s.

https://nnescenicmodelrr.com

 

Reply 0
Ken Rice

Variety

If you've got a number of these stretches a bit of variety will probably be best.

A 10-20' radius curve in N scale looks awesome, by the way.  I'd recommend using a single big curve in at least 1 location.

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David Husman dave1905

Tangents

I would suggest the answer lies in what part of the country and the feel that is trying to be conveyed.

In some parts of the country the railroad can have tangents that are dozens of miles long.  Other parts of the country the railroads are curvier than a snake's rump.

The first part of this video was shot out of the back of a gas electric doodlebug running along my prototype:

The portion from 0:48 to about 2:15 was shot on the railroad I model.  Obviously, I will be minimizing tangents.

On the other hand if I was modeling in the upper Midwest or the plains, I might want to emphasize the tangents.

In any case, I wouldn't want the track exactly parallel to the fascia, I would want it at a shallow angle to improve the look.  I think that curves are scenically more interesting because they give multiple angle views of the trains.  

Dave Husman

Visit my website :  https://wnbranch.com/

Blog index:  Dave Husman Blog Index

Reply 0
railbaronmike

Angled or Undulating

You might also consider small elevation changes between towns, maybe your line follows a river through part of its journey. Dip down to cross a river then climb back up to the next town. Mike in Florida.
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jimfitch

I would suggest the answer

Quote:

I would suggest the answer lies in what part of the country and the feel that is trying to be conveyed.

 

That's a biggie.  Think David Barrows CM&SF RR with long stretches of straight mimicking the region he was modeling.  OTOH, D&RGW didn't have much straight tangent on much of their mainline thru the Rockies.

.

Jim Fitch
northern VA

Reply 0
Brent Ciccone Brentglen

Curves

Nothing like watching a train weave it’s way through a bunch of curves, especially the dreaded S curve.

Brent Ciccone

Calgary

Reply 0
ctxmf74

"What are folks

Quote:

"What are folks thoughts/tastes/preferences on mostly undulating curves versus very gradual slow single curve or long angle on straight sections between locations in a wooded and field-dotted countryside? I am interested from the vantage points of both rail-fanning and operations"

  What do you see when looking at the prototype? Do you most notice curves, or grades , or tangents, or what? Differnt railroad leave different impressions. Modeling Tehachapi I'd go for curves and steady grades while in the valley below I'd go for straight as an arrow paralleling the the fascia as the highway does the railroad for 100 miles or so to the north....DaveB

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edfhinton

Mix by terrain

Thanks.  This is all very helpful.  I have looked at the maps for the prototype, and I can adjust to straighter/slightly curving sections on one level matching the minimal curving on the prototype and put in more undulations on another level where the prototype curves a lot more. 

The discussion helped me to think about why the tracks would or wouldn't curve.  And when I started thinking that way and now rechecked the maps, that matches what the maps show.  Where the area is roughly flat with little or no obstacles, the track was mostly straight.  Where hills and lakes take over, it curves around them.  That will help with my scenic work when the time comes because there will be natural reasons for those undulations.

Thanks,

-Ed

 

 

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Proprietor - Northern New England Scenic (V3). N scale NH B&M Eastern and western coastal routes in the mid-1950s.

https://nnescenicmodelrr.com

 

Reply 0
Wabash Banks

variation

As a variation, a curve could be put in place for a reason, the railroad crosses a stream or river at an angle that would not make sense with straight track. The track can curve to a more suitable crossing angle and then resume back to the straight. This would be where the water is running nearly parallel to the track but make a jog that causes the railroad to cross it. The tourist railroad I volunteer on has a couple of spots like this. You could also have a train enter mid way back and then gently curve all the way to the back and pass behind a farm or other such thing just for visual interest. Just make sure you can easily reach a derailed train because it is a sure thing that if it derails that will be where it happens despite you best efforts otherwise

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Oztrainz

Depends on many things...

Hi Ed, all

Your answer depends on many things. In the real world, the result of straight or curved track is an interaction of history and available technology. 

Some aspects of history:

  • Land ownership - If your railroad was one of the early ones, the route could be affected by land ownership and the politics attached to it. If a landowner had a enough "clout" to resist the railroad coming through their land, then the railroad would find another way to get through with a deviation around the "no-go-there" land.
  • Geography - ideally trains run best if the grade is flat or favours downhill the route of most loaded trains. If the geography is not ideal, the track can be deviated away from the straight line path between 2 points so as to optimise train performance, especially if the performance of the locomotives of the time is limited. 

    However tight curves following the terrain can easily add significantly to the effective grade resistance faced by your trains, resulting in reduced hauling capacity in the days of smaller locomotives. 

    Don't be fooled by what the eye perceives as flat. Sometimes what appears flat may be tilted and may not actually be "horizontally flat".
  • Bridges and tunnels - cost big money, so the route would be generally planned to minimise the length of costly items like bridges. That means ideally the track crosses waterways perpendicularly where possible. Dodgy foundations and a whole flock of other reasons might cause deviation from this design policy, but the ideal approach would be to jump these obstacles in as short a distance as possible, even if that means slightly deviating the tracks with curves and a slightly longer track to get the correct approach angle. 

Some aspects of available technology

  • If labour is cheap and plentiful and the available technology is shovels and wheelbarrows, then cutting through a hill to maintain a straight alignment may be the preferred construction option.
  • If labour is scarce and costly and the available technology is shovels and wheelbarrows, then going around a hill rather than through it gets your tracks further quicker and cheaper, overturning the advantages of a straight alignment at the cost of increasing your operating costs when compared to the straight route. 
  • If modern technology is available (Bulldozers, jumbo drill rigs for drilling basting holes, etc), then it may make more sense to amortise the higher construction costs when compared to cheaper running costs of trains that can haul more on a straighter flatter track profile.
  • longer bridges with an extra span or two came into their own once concrete supports and steel plate girder or truss bridges became available. Again making a straighter track alignment possible
  • Available locomotives - The same track worked by small steam locomotives, operating at their maximum performance when the track was built, would not be a problem for multiple diesel electric locomotive lash-ups available today. 

   How much of this applies to your design is up to you, but you can justify straights or curves as you see fit.

Regards,

John Garaty

Unanderra in oz

Read my Blog

Reply 0
Jeff Youst

Prefer the Look Of Curves

When designing my plan using the valuation maps I obtained from the historical society, it was apparent that there were long stretches of tangent track most everywhere - both in the towns and countryside.  It is western Ohio after all. Occasionally there would be a big sweeping curve to help alter the direction, but these were few and far between.  With selective compression ruling the scaling down of the plan and selective towns / cities to include, I just opted to place most every stretch of track, including those going thru metropolitan areas on long, gentle sweeping curves.  For me it's all about aesthetics and that is avoiding as many straight lines as possible.  To each his own and Rule #1 always applies. 

Jeff 
Erie Lackawanna Marion Div.
Dayton Sub 1964
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