the MRH Forum

What reasons justify a single track lift bridge Dream and design
Reply
Prolific poster 2,867 posts kleaverjr Prolific poster 2,867 posts
kleaverjr

From other sources, I have just been told that lift bridges would not have been allowed in the Pittsburgh area because of the high density of traffic in the rivers.  I also have been informed that there would not have been any kind of canal coming into PA or OH from Lake Erie to allow boats to get any further inland to connect to the Ohio River because the railroads would have opposed it because it would be a major loss in revenue from teh iro ore and coal traffic.  So now i'm in the very bad position of having a model of a single track bridge that i want to incorporate into the P&A Layout, but have no way to reasonably justify it.  Just saying "it's my railroad and i will do what I want" is not a good enough reason because doing so goes too far from the plausibilty benchmark.

For the moment i can't think of any other reason a railroad would have a lift bridge other than a river crossing, but if someone could help think of some reasons, I would be glad to hear them.  The modeled portion of the proto-freelance P&A starts just west of Erie, PA (interchanging with the NYC and NKP) heads south to Pittsburgh, and there is a jct 23 miles northeast (along the Allegheny River) where the mainline heads east to Harrisburg (the modeled portion ends about 30 miles east of the jct).  So the primary rivers/creeks the P&A is near is the Allegheny River, French Creek, and the Kiskimmi River.

Thanks for any feedback.

Ken L
Reply 0
Greg Baker Mountaingoatgreg Prolific poster 1,334 posts
Greg Baker Mountaingoatgreg

Not usre this helps....

In Oregon they would often build lift bridges on any body of water that could possibly be expanded for river traffic. There are tons on lift bridges in Oregon that that have never opened for river traffic.  

Another option would be that they bought the bridge from another railroad to replace an older structure. Although the bridge looks like a lift bridge it has been welded shut and the lifting mechanism has been removed. 

Not sure either of these are water tight stories...I hope they send you in a good direction. 

"Mountain Goat" Greg Baker

https://www.facebook.com/mountaingoatmodels/
Reply 0
kleaverjr Prolific poster 2,867 posts
kleaverjr

That just might help

That just might help Greg! Though the PRR used a Truss Bridge to cross over the Kiskimee (sp?) River, since the P&A acquires the right of way from teh Allegheny Valley Railway before the PRR could (in my "version" of history) because there is river traffic i might have the bridge crossing that river  be a lift bridge.  I will have to think on that.  Thanks! 

Ken L.
Reply 0
UPWilly Prolific poster 1,965 posts
UPWilly

Ken, Try the spelling "Kiskiminetas"

As I read your post, the name did not sound right, even though I don't normally concern myself with the PA area. I checked it out and I believe the spelling is "Kiskiminetas" or "Kiski" for short.

 

Bill D.

egendpic.jpg 

N Scale (1:160), not N Gauge. DC (analog), Stapleton PWM Throttle.

Proto-freelance Southwest U.S. 2nd half 20th Century.

Keep on trackin'
Reply 0
jamis New member 20 posts
jamis

Used Bridges...

The Toledo Terminal Railroad had a swing bridge across the Maumee River that never opened.  The swing pedistal was there, but there never was any machinery installed to swing it.  The funny thing is, the bridge is over 70 feet above the water surface and there is no history that any sailing ships ever went that far upstream after the bridge was installed in 1902.  The river level is really pretty shallow there anyway.  One theory is that the bridge was purchased used for the rapid construction of the railroad (1902 -1905) and was installed simply as a fixed bridge.  It was single tracked all of its life.   
Reply 0
Russ Bellinis Prolific poster 3,335 posts
Russ Bellinis

A lift bridge does not mean that there is commercial traffic.

There is quite a bit of rail traffic on Terminal Island here in So Cal between Long Beach and Los Angeles Harbors.  The onlky way for trains to come on or off the Island is over the Henry Ford draw bridge.  There is a highway lift bridge next to the Henry Ford draw bridge (or there was, it may have been replaced by a taller bridge that doesn't need to open).  I have never seen any sort of freighter go under that bridge.  I'm not sure that the highway lift bridge was tall enought to clear a freighter anyway.  The shipping would either come around the South side of the Island if docking on the Long Beach end or the North side of the Island if docking on the Los Angeles end.  The draw bridge and lfit bridge was there for sail boats, fishing boats, and yachts to get under.  The Henry Ford bridge is low enough to require it to lift to clear almost any boat that might come by.
Reply 0
jimdennis Active Member 34 posts
jimdennis

What reasons justify a single track lift bridge

If you get a chance to visit Cleveland, take a drive along the Cuyahoga River where it meets Lake Erie.  The number and variety of lift bridges still standing and in operation are staggering.  In a mile long stretch of the river you have everything from bascules and lifts, in single track as well as double track configurations.  This on a river that supported plenty of traffic in it's support of the steel industry.
Reply 0
Reply