the MRH Forum

smooth rolling trucks Locos and rolling stock
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Regular poster 434 posts Danno164 Regular poster 434 posts
Danno164

Occasionally I splurge and spend what I call high end prices on rolling stock- $35 to $50 a car, however I mostly stay within the $25 to $35 range when purchasing rolling stock due to budget etc., Now I know the old saying is you get what you pay for, I have purchased Walther's "mainline" 50ft box cars $24,  on a scale of 1 to 10 in roll ability I give them a 3 or 4 at best, on a slight grade and a small nudge they stop within the grade, that's great if my spur is on a grade but not so great when creating drag during operating. I  purchased walthers proto they are an 8 maybe 9,  Athearn  gets a 7 to an 8 , Atlas high end a 10. I know there are many more manufacturers out there and I was never really into the details and smooth operation roll ability of rolling stock until now. Can anyone suggest a particular manufacture of sold separately trucks/wheel sets that are top notch that I can use as simple replacements without to much modification? Also did atlas re-tool and now use a screw to attach trucks vs the old pin method? 

Daniel
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blindog10 Prolific poster 3,329 posts
blindog10

as always, depends on your era

If you are into the steam or transition eras, you need to know about Tahoe Model Works. He makes a nice variety of> accurate < trucks for freight cars. They come with metal wheels (choice of code 110 or 88 width) and are reasonably priced. Kato offers two trucks, the ASF 50-ton A-3 plain bearing and a Barber 70-ton S-2 roller bearing. Both are extremely free rolling. Walthers sells the former Proto:2000 trucks separately, and if appropriate they come with either smooth-back or ribbed-back wheels. The cross-sectional contour of their wheels is quite accurate. Lastly, I'll plug good old American-made Kadee, which has expanded their line of trucks considerably in the last ten years. Alongside their traditional line of cast-metal trucks they now have a full line of plastic trucks, and the newer versions mount on Athearn et al without modification. Being a diesel era modeler I use a lot of the Kadee trucks. Scott Chatfield
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Danno164 Regular poster 434 posts
Danno164

Scott thank you tons, I am

Scott thank you tons, I am attempting to model the early seventies to mid eighties.  I will check out Kadee. I am not well versed on truck terminology but for my era 40 and 50 ft cars three springs in the trucks would be appropriate correct?  

Daniel
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Alco_nut Regular poster 401 posts
Alco_nut

Truck turner

I use the truck tuner from Micro Mark to improve the rolling quality of most of my trucks. I have also replaced most wheels on the trucks with Proto 2K wheels. This saves money over replacing the trucks. I agree with Scott on the Kadee trucks I use them also. 

https://www.micromark.com/HO-Truck-Tuner_2

 

Bob

Jersey Northern RR

http://jerseynorthern.webs.com

https://youtube.com/channel/UCyAziSSu5A6d8ojWBiG1xGQ
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ErieMan47 Regular poster 307 posts
ErieMan47

Kadee uses sintered metal wheels

Just be aware that there are 2 types of metal wheels in use-- those made from sintered metal and those that are machined from solid metal stock.  Kadee wheels are sintered.  There seems to be general agreement that sintered wheels pick up grime more easily and spread it around as compared to machined metal wheels.

For example, read this thread: https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/are-metal-wheelsets-worth-it-12202129

Lots of information that will be helpful is contained in the MRH "Run LIke a Dream" Rolling Stock book.  Joe Fugate mentions another important consideration: metal vs plastic axles.

Dennis
Modeling the Erie RR Delaware Division in the early 1950s in HO
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blindog10 Prolific poster 3,329 posts
blindog10

more complicated than that

The number of springs in a real truck is higher than seen in model trucks. That is the big beef with older sprung trucks, those with actual springs between the sideframe and bolster. You see, the visible springs on a truck are only the outer set or row. Most trucks have three rows of springs. Those rows are usually two or three springs wide. So you usually can't see through the springs the way you can on model sprung trucks. So why do trucks have different numbers of springs? Their load capacity and the ratio between load and tare (weight of the car itself). It plays out like this. Most 40-foot boxcars were only rated for 50 tons, so they had "50-ton" trucks. This meant the trucks had 33-inch wheels, a wheelbase of 5'6", and five or six springs (arranged 2-1-2 or 2-2-2). Most 50-foot boxcars built before 1968 were rated for 70 tons, so their trucks had a 5'8" wheelbase and springs arranged 2-2-2 or 2-3-2. Wheels remained 33-inch. Also the actual journal bearing, be it plain or roller, got bigger as the weight went up. Most 50-foot boxcars built after 1968 were rated for 77 tons, so their trucks are still 5'8" but generally have springs arranged 3-2-3. This is Accurail's roller bearing truck, BTW. It's the only such 77-ton truck I'm aware of in HO. Roller bearings were mandatoty on all new cars starting in 1968. Now please note that other cars were rated at 77 tons but had "70-ton" trucks. This is because they had lower load-to-tare ratios. 100-ton trucks have a 5'10" wheelbase, 36-inch wheels, and springs arranged 3-3-3. This is still true for today's 110-ton trucks. The weight limits were raised in 1995. Plain bearing trucks were outlawed in interchange at the same time. Scott Chatfield
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Danno164 Regular poster 434 posts
Danno164

Bob thank you, I take it that

Bob thank you, I take it that that removes or deepens the pocket for the wheel axel to spin more freely? when you have done so what brand of wheels do you prefer to use or do you just put the originals back in after tweaking the truck? 

Daniel
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Danno164 Regular poster 434 posts
Danno164

Dennis thank you, Kadee uses

Dennis thank you, Kadee uses sintered wheels, I have no idea what sintered means, I can look it up but if you can explain great if not no worries,  all metal wheel sets are better? I will check out run like a dream. There are just too many options out there, its like trying to pick out tooth paste. why did that get so difficult? (that's my attempt at comedy)  

Daniel
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Danno164 Regular poster 434 posts
Danno164

Scott  I think you have

Scott  I think you have replied to some of my previous posts. Thank you for sharing your knowledge. Did you work for a railroad? As I have aged I am much more interested in accuracy and correctness of my modeling than I ever thought I would be.. Thank you for your reply.   

Daniel
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blindog10 Prolific poster 3,329 posts
blindog10

sintered is pressed and baked powder

There's several types of sintered metal. But since they all start as powder, the resulting casting is somewhat porous. Yes, Kadee wheels are sintered. So are Proto's, but they nickel plate them after casting. Still, I've seen Proto wheels with the plating worn off. I've also seen brass wheels with nickel plating have the plating worn off off after many miles of running. Most of us don't put that many miles on their cars. That said, I have a few dozen cars thst have over 1,000 real miles on them runnibg on display layouts and I didn't notice much trouple with either the Kadee or Proto wheels. Keeping the track reasonably clean to begin with and not allowing any plastic wheels on the tracks is key. Truck tuners definitely help with metal axles. You want just a slight amount of side-to-side play in the axle. Too much is not good. As for those Walthers that don't roll well, you might check to see that the axle ends are free of burrs. If they aren't truly pointed they won't roll well. Dress the tip with a few strokes of a file. Scott Chatfield
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Alco_nut Regular poster 401 posts
Alco_nut

Truck tuner

The Truck Tuner's extra-sharp tool-steel cutter reshapes the bearing to the NMRA's recommended 60 degree contour and cleans out burrs and grime. If the origonal wheels are plastic or still don't turn better I then replace them with the Proto 2K. I have used it for years and have had great sucess with it. 

Bob

Jersey Northern RR

http://jerseynorthern.webs.com

https://youtube.com/channel/UCyAziSSu5A6d8ojWBiG1xGQ
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blindog10 Prolific poster 3,329 posts
blindog10

The Southern, God's Own Railway

Where among a number of other things, I spent a lot of time inspecting inbound piggyback flats for overloading and other problems. So yes, I got quite familiar with freight car trucks and their springs. No, I am not 100% anal about my model freight cars' trucks. But I am somewhere north of 80%.... Scott Chatfield
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peter-f Prolific poster 1,534 posts
peter-f

Trucks without or with wheels ?

Trucks without wheelsets I get from Accurail...   visit their website for many types & colors (colors?)    Lots of molded-in casting details (foundry name is clear on Accurail).

Trucks With wheelsets, I'd get from Kadee.  

My go-to wheelsets are Intermountaisn or Kadee... if I need the wheel makers' cast-in name, it's Kadee.  Plain unmarked wheels are Intermountain on my rolling stock...

Now, it's simply assemble and replace...   (new Accurail pricing) - current costs about $5 per pair. (4 wheelsets / 2 trucks)

Lifelike / Proto2000 have plastic axles... and I've had problems with a few of those.

As for rolling characteristics, I never found these combinations to require adjustments.  (but just how my standards compare to yours, I cant say)
- regards

Peter
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Danno164 Regular poster 434 posts
Danno164

Scott thank you sir, things

Scott thank you sir, things ya don't think about when you assume they should all run or roll the same. Thank you. 

Daniel
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Danno164 Regular poster 434 posts
Danno164

Peter thank you. I actually

Peter thank you. I actually had a few accurail kits that I assembled that roll better than ready to roll products. 

Daniel
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