The space

Outside dimensions of the space is 16’x24’. Beyond the wall opposite the door is an area above the carport (in the rafters) that is not off limits but would be awkward to access. 

Givens and Druthers

Given my space is 16’x24’ (less wall thicknesses) and On30 for my choice of scale / gage to represent the 36” width of the OR&L. Although my freight cars are only about 30’ long (max) or about 7-1/2”, I like passenger trains that are from 36’ - 42’ long. A 3x car length makes a 36” radius a minimum and 42” radius preferred.

Mainline trains are fun to watch run so a continuous connection would be preferred and a drop leaf in front of the door would be acceptable. Locals are my primary love with the feared locomotives a preference. 

It would be my druthers to have some quiet scenery, even if very shallow benchwork is required, to give trains a feeling of travel and destination. A yard is not necessary but the ability to make up trains, even manually, would be desirable. Transfer tables, or 0-5-0 switcher, with storage is acceptable. 

Very little hidden track and no hidden staging. 

A one town concept with supporting elements is desired but a portion of a branch would be ideal. 

I use switchlists and generally operate alone. Automated mainline trains for guests or railfanning will be explored from the start. CMRI or JMRI or Arduino controls in conjunction with sensors and servo controlled mainline switches, and working signals need experimentation and hardware decided early on. 

Anything else?

Waipahu Junction & Wahiawa Branch

While Waipahu didn’t have a number of industries, it did see a lot of rail traffic!

The branch served the Oahu Sugar Mill (Waipahu), Dole Pineapple fields (and a decent yard), and Schofield Military base. 

Dole on the Wahiawa Branch

Some great maps to peruse!

And in 1920 Shays rules the road. 

Aiea Mill

Neil,

Here is the post card that turned me on to the sugar mill at Aiea and a snip of the insurance map of the mill, I will send a photo of my mock up of my condensed version 

Aiea mill condensed version

Sugar Mills

@clauer: Looks great! Is this part of a larger layout? I’m not sure if you mentioned the scale. Your version looks very similar to the mill I have started as well in On30. 

Above is a mock up for scale and the image on the right is an experiment in building up flats to give a bigger model in a small footprint. 

Film of what appears to be a train from Oahu.

WWII

World War 2 was big business for Hawai’i’s  railroads. There is a lot to be considered with regard to modeling this period. I much prefer earlier periods from 1900 - 1920’s. 

Aiea Mill

Neil,

My scale is ON30, layout is small shelf 10’ long and 2’ deep so not much room, that’s why I condensed the size of mill. With cane cars and only short box/ flat/ tank cars being used I will be able to use more cars per track length my hope is will feel bigger.

Don't forget the Fowlers..

Hi Neil and all,

The John Fowler Patent locomotives that ran in Hawaii have been mentioned on here previously. Here's the link to keep it all together here -   https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/sugar-cane-car-12202048 

These were seriously small locomotives (probably about 6 to 8 tons) that ran from the canefields to the mill. In the link there is mention of a book on these locomotives in Hawaii. If anyone is interested in modelling one of these unique beasties, then tracking down a copy of that book would probably be a great start.  

Hey Neil....

Hi Neil and all,

Have you had a close look at the track arrangement near the Engine Shed at Waipahu Junction??

Shock horror - it's almost a "Time-Saver".  The mythical beast may have been found!!! Who'd a thunk it in Hawaii??  You can't build it that way..Not a Time-Saver..It's a No-No. It wouldn't be a real model railroad. 

Tongue planted very firmly in cheek,

it's almost a "Time-Saver"...Not

You are just looking at a close up view with the rest of the tracks not showing.

You are seeing what is not there.

Still Mythical.

almost only works in hand grenades

Duck & Run

John - You and Azbaja are pulling all the stops today! 

I seriously don’t have a problem with JA’s game but having played the app version to the end, it becomes wearing. To do so in a social environment as intended (beer or wine included) could be fun. Michael? 

Az is right though. The tracks are only shown in part. Here is the big picture:

The full trackplan

Hi Neil,

Those are some serious length sidings. Were the trains really that long or were they passing trains on the run without stopping using sprung or gravity-biased turnouts at each end of the passing loops? There has to be a reason for sidings that long. Track costs money and railroad company's traditionally don't like spending money on track or anything else (unless they have to). 

http://www.criticalpast.com/v

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675062970_railroad-station_buildings-along-a-side_train-passing_equipment-loaded-on-train

John-check out this video! Train lengths varied considerably. The last one in this video is powered by one 2-8-2  “mudhen” and was probably 38 cars long. The Wahiawa Branch reports talk about 220-260 Ron trains or 15-22 narrow gauge cars. 

I’ve been looking for an image I saw of )2) 2-8-0’s double heading garbage train. These outside frame locomotives must have been a sight to rival anything that runs in Chama today. 

Semaphore and brakes questions

Hi Neil and all,

In the background of the first 2 trains was a semaphore signal that drops as the train passes in the foreground.The signal blade appears to have a pointed end?

How were these controlled (automatic track circuit?/CTC?/manually pulled from a dedicated nearby location/signal box/gound frame)? And what did they signify (clear section ahead?/permission to proceed?/conditional permission? or other?)

BTW Neil - this tells you how fast your servo driving any model semaphores has to move  

That's a fascinating video - Also notice the number of roof riders (I'm assuming brakemen?) on the larger train. There must have been some ferocious grades somehwere to require that many brakemen to apply and release the handbrakes while on the run?? There's something going on here if the Westinghouse wasn't sufficient brakes for the run. The Westinghouse compressor can be spotted on the running board of the loco running tender first in the video so at least some of the train must have been air-brake fitted. One wonders if some of the wagons weren't air brake fitted? Curious?? 

iPad App Timesaver

I THOUGHT that was your handle Neil, beating my score on every job.  Grrrrr.  I still have two towns to go, but I agree it gets a little wearing.  Not so much in person at shows, even with no beer involved.  Maybe that's because I'm watching other people switch it, rather than doing it myself.

Basic Shapes

Hi Neil,

These are not track-plans per-se but I did a quick draw of your room dimensions with a thought to see what continuous-run shapes might fit with 42" radius curve minimum.  These don't take into account the LDE's being discussed, although I was seeking long straight areas for passing tracks/industry switching.  They also don't account for headroom on the sloping ceiling.  But, here's what I've come up with so far, just to generate ideas.

One thing you didn't mention was grades, but you did mention very little if any hidden track, so I tried to avoid that.

Are any of these anywhere near what you have in mind?

Auto Reverse?

One thing you mentioned is watching a train run is enjoyable for you.  Toward that end, the shapes I drew were loops or dogbones.  But I'm curious if you like the idea of a one track main with reverse loops?  That could be done possibly with a little more real estate for the actual layout by adding a grade and putting the loops above one another.  The loops could be automated with two DCC Specialties PSX-AR autoreversing circuit breakers.  I just installed two of these, and they have contacts that will automatically throw Tortoise switch machines as trains enter and exit the loop. 

Something like this. 

The top loop could be visible and one featured area.  The back wall could be another, but would stretch realism a bit since the train would pass through it twice, unless you hid the track.  I don't find that a deal breaker, but some do.  I'm thinking a small yard along the back wall for fiddling trains off and on, and switching them too.  One destination in the bottom right loop.  One in the bottom left corner.  That track leading down to staging could be hidden as it passes under the loop on the top left.  Dunno, just more brainstorming.  

What do you think?

Dog bones and C shapes

Michael:  Thanks! All these ideas are fair game but the slope of the ceiling either puts the track down at about 42”-44” or away from the wall a foot or more. In fact, standing and facing the end walls means being about four feet away as I am 6’-4” tall and the roof slopes from 48” up at a 7:12 pitch. 

After reading Brian’s blog on radius and then going back to Joe’s article, it seems as though I should consider larger radiuses as the layout is lower than eye level? I also am considering a twice around the room rather than any return loops at all. Staging would be open along the long wall behind a shallow backdrop. 

What program are you using? I also use a Mac but haven’t tried any railroad design software (being more an acad or SketchUp guy). btw - I did make it to the end of the timesaver game and have thought about making an On30 version of it. Would be fun to go outside my era with a diesel (god I said it!) or a boxcar critter. 

Railroad design software

Hi Neil,

"Scarm" is easy to play with and comes with a 3D incorporated. Many tutorials are provided on the website. And it's free to a certain point. You'll find all the info on the "scarm" website.

Happy designing - I'm curious to see your 'vision' developing !

Greetings, filip

CADRail

Hi Neil,

I use CADRail 8 on Windows 10, which I've had for several years.  I'm happy to work on the track plan with you as you develop your ideas, if you'd like.  I'll mock up the twice around here soon.  Do you have a preference on track brand and switch size?  That has a big effect on design. 

I hear good things about SCARM, but have not worked with it.

New Idea

Hi Neil,

Here's an idea based on your map with Dole.  It's a more relaxed plan with one main track.  Staging would make use of the "dead" area under the roof, behind a backdrop, while all the usable track is out at least 4' from the walls.  I indicated a couple of industries from the map.  

These are 42" radius curves and the switches are #6.  I set the track separation at 5" in the small yard, but I'm not familiar with On30.  Is that an appropriate number?