Mitchell Schuessler

Hello all, I just joined this forum because my long term plans for my dream layout would be blasphemy on my current forum. I love N-scale, and I will keep modeling it, and always appreciate it. The modeling community is also great at nscale.net, and I will always be over there with our 160. But after numerous discussions and research, my plans are better in HO scale.

Backstory:

My dad grew up in Columbia, PA, a small river town along the Susquehanna. As a kid (along with permission), I was always down at the tracks foaming at trains. It was an interesting area with an interesting history. The main part being my obsession with catenary. I never saw any pictures of catenary up, nor the E44s, E33s, and GG1s that frequently passed through there. Only the remnants of the catenary poles. This is until I obtained the fantastic book of Triumph II by David Messer. Numerous photos of the area with P5s, modifieds, and G's in PRR paint, along with Penn Central and Conrail.

I was hooked immediately, and decided that was going to be "my railway".

Planning:

I would like to do full catenary, and based around 1975-77 when Conrail had ownership, but all the locomotives were unmarked PRR, the minimal CR black, and a few new blues. Andy Rubbo has a great technique and artistry for his catenary that was featured in model railroader, and I was able to find a few articles of his in the Keystone Modeler. The route would start at the Chickies creek bridge before Lake Siding begins, go through Columbia yard, past Cola tower, Manor Siding, the flyover at Creswell, and end at the double bridges at Safe Harbor. Then, also including the Columbia Secondary that goes to Lancaster yard in another room or something (information and pictures of this will be in the next post). This would allow to do some great through traffic from two main lines (Port Road and the Low Grade), and then do some switching and ops (Columbia Secondary with numerous industries and Lancaster yard).

Due to the complexity of the route, the infrastructure (mainly the catenary), and obtaining E44s, I figured this could be a lifelong project. I've done more research, and tracked down one of the photographers of the Columbia area in Triumph II, and talked to him. He told me about three more books I should buy, and he happened to be a tower operator at Cola during the time. He was able to give me detailed explanations of operations, signaling, traffic, and answered any questions I had.

In terms of construction, I figured I would go modular. Most is either double tracked or three tracks. I could start with simple sections, especially for practice on the catenary. Then I would graduate to the serious "nets" in the Columbia area, which are irresistible to me. I could also do all the interlockings, then when the time comes, just connect them all with the straight and curved sections of track. This would allow me to work on all sides of the track, and not worry about destroying catenary working on scenery or anything. Along with being able to run trains on the modules until I have the amount of space to make the layout. I figured the switch machines I could build into them, signaling pre wired, and track power wired. Then just plug the modules into the rest of the system.

Conclusion:

I probably wouldn't have anything major done for a while. As I'm still in school, and have limited funds, space, time, etc. But I feel like good discussions early on would help immensely, and it would be fun planning a layout of this region. I can probably start small, and build study models of catenary poles, trackwork, and signals. Then maybe start the module of the crossover, and turnout onto Manor Siding.

Looking forward to your replies and input!

-Mitch 

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Mitchell Schuessler

Research on the Internet

Here are some nice photo galleries by Bob Kise in the area. Shows nice detail of the trains going through there, the track work, catenary, and scenery.

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/locThumbs.aspx?id=116111

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/locThumbs.aspx?id=171432

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/locThumbs.aspx?id=112484&Page=1

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/locThumbs.aspx?id=119993

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/locThumbs.aspx?id=118440

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/locThumbs.aspx?id=116761

Here is a blog from Jersey Mike, and he basically "walks" the port road. My layout would start just after SHOCKS and end at HARBOR, so basically Part 7 to Part 10. He has some track diagrams for COLA, which under Conrail, controlled from SHOCKS to CRESS. He also covers the signals nicely also.

http://position-light.blogspot.com/search/label/Port%20Road

 

Reply 0
George J

Holtwood

During the timeframe you're talking, there was a coal fired power plant in addition to the hydroelectric plant at Holtwood PA. It would be an ideal destination for unit coal trains.

When you say "modular" I'm assuming you actually mean "sectional" as any layout that involves catenary would be a nightmare to assemble and disassemble on a regular basis.

Finally, don't forget Amtrak. They used the Port Road as a short cut to avoid Philadelphia. a couple of "heritage" coaches and a black GG-1 lettered for Amtrak is about all you'd need.

 

"And the sons of Pullman porters and the sons of engineers, ride their father's magic carpet made of steel..."

Milwaukee Road : Cascade Summit- Modeling the Milwaukee Road in the 1970s from Cle Elum WA to Snoqualmie Summit at Hyak WA.

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Mitchell Schuessler

Sectional Over Time

Thanks for the info! I have thought about the coal trains that run through there. I think they are usually empty coming back west right? I've seen people make working coal loaders and unloaders, and I always thought that would be an interesting project. It would be nice to have something on the line to do some mild operations, and that Amtrak service would be nice for a beginner and guests.

In terms of the modular, I wouldn't join the interlockings together until I was in a place that could fit the "final form" as they would say. Along with the catenary. Maybe to have two interlocking segments while still in an apartment, and working out all the kinks of construction, leading to the full construction of the layout later in my life. From building my 4'x4' N scale layout I have now, the places that have switches and signals would be the most complicated, and would be easier to work on individually instead of in situ. Have the switches, motors, signals, track wiring all in place, and just "plugging in" when you need it. The straight sections really only have power feeds and straight or curved.

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Mitchell Schuessler

Module Planning

Well, I've been doing some more planning. I decided I want to slowly make a small 3' x 10" module, of part of an interlocking. I'm starting with Cres or Creswell, as it is the simplest. Only a single turnout for the siding that joins to the Low Grade. It will also be within budget to make at this point in my life, simultaneously being able to get my train fix. 

It will only have 3 cat poles, two being for single track. Considering that I would be running a lot of the 89' auto racks and piggy-backs, I want to use #8 turnouts for anything on the main. I think I'd also like to try my hand in hand-laid switches. Now that I have access to a CNC, I think I can just make a template out of some wood or MDF (maybe you guys could chime in on which materials you think I might need). I'll make it so I can easily join snap track to it to run trains, and then later when it is installed on the final layout. It will have a similar design to Pelle Søeborg's sound proofing if you've read "Rebuilding a Layout". The scenery is simple as the Susquehanna River is only 25 feet away from the outer rails, and 25 feet to the other side is the hill that goes up to the edge of the Low Grade 30 feet above. 

Here is the basic track plan:

CKING(1).jpg 

Location Photos:

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/575614/

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3592983

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3586368

http://gg1bob.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3586366

Location on Google Maps

https://goo.gl/maps/M3JQP86E4BT2

I was wondering if I could get opinions on the best module construction that could last 40+ years. I know its a while, but it is quite a project, and might as well start early taking small bites out of it. 

Reply 0
ctxmf74

 "As I'm still in school,

Quote:

 "As I'm still in school, and have limited funds, space, time, etc. But I feel like good discussions early on would help immensely, and it would be fun planning a layout of this region. I can probably start small, and build study models of catenary poles, trackwork, and signals. "

When time and money are in short  supply learning skills is a good way to spend whatever time you might find. Anything you learn now will speed up the construction of a layout later. How to glue, paint, and otherwise work with modeling materials is the basic first step. Soldering should be learned before thinking about laying track. Also investing any spare money in good basic lifetime tools should be a priority before buying rolling stock and other kits.  A simple goal like building one quality lineside structure or turnout from scratch would be enough for a semester of spare time for instance. Once you graduate and settle into a job you'll have the money to proceed with a layout and will have built a good collection of skills and tools to speed along the process......DaveB

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DrJolS

PRR-Modelers group

You haven't mentioned it, and you may already be using it.

The PRR-Modelers Group on Yahoo! can be very helpful.

DrJolS, SPF

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Mitchell Schuessler

Thanks!

You couldn't be more correct Dave. The area I'm modeling can look desolate sometimes, so track and trackside detail will make the scene. Especially since I have no clue where I will end up settling down, having small modules will be manageable. I'll probably invest in a better soldering gun than the one I have now.

DrJois, I'll have a look! I'm still searching for specific dimensions on catenary poles and other wayside details, so that group will be very helpful. 

I was able to track down a man by the name of Chet Fuhrman, who worked in Cola tower in the late 60's, and continued taking photos of rail operations in the area for the years to come. He was able to give me plenty of information on operations and situations that happened on the line. He graciously gave me some PRR order sheets, a schedule, and the top of a train order stick. It was really helpful for figuring out what kind of operations I could model. It will definitely be a "tower operator" layout, as he said there were over 50 scheduled trains through the area per day, not counting the locals and other special trains.

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