Deemiorgos
My first inglenook and first time using Peco code 83 seen here on this thread. http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/15656?page=3
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Deemiorgos

Today I soldered the rails

Today I soldered the rails together using .020 brass wire and soldered on the feed wires. I tested a few locos on it and they all ran well over the Peco turnouts, except one little switcher that sometimes stalled on the plastic insulfrog; probably dirty wheels?

I primed the rails and ties with spray paint as I usually do. 

I use cheap car pinstriping to mask off the rails. 

After it dries completely, I'm thinking of using my airbrush for the first time to paint the rails, but don't know if I should paint the ties first. I usually use Floquil pens for the sides of the rails after painting the ties, but they're not available anymore. Is it possible with an airbrush to paint the sides of the rail without getting hardly any on the ties?

 

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ctxmf74

paint the sides of the rail without getting any on the ties?

    Yeah, if you can paint the sides from a low angle it's possible. An airbrush with top feed or small color cup instead of a paint bottle hanging down  makes it easier to paint from shallow angle Paint with pollyscale or other acylics then wipe off the rail tops with a damp paper towel as soon as you finish a section. If using solvent based paint and thinner the cleaning time is extended but the smell is a lot worse. This also works with those small modelers spray cans if you don't want to use an airbrush but they cost quite a bit for the amount of painting they contain... .DaveB

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Deemiorgos

I'm glad to know it is

I'm glad to know it is possible Dave. I think I'll practice on some scrap track first since it will be my first time using an airbrush. In the meantime I will start mixing various shades of brown acrylic paint for the ties. I like applying a light wash of colour to the ties before I paint them individually. For some reason I really like this aspect of the hobby.
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splitrock323

Looking good

I want to build one of these to bring to train shows and just have in the house to test out my operators skills. Pleas sleep us informed of the progress. Did you build for 40 foot cars? And what length of engine are you using? Thomas G.

Thomas W. Gasior MMR

Modeling northern Minnesota iron ore line in HO.

YouTube: Splitrock323      Facebook: The Splitrock Mining Company layout

Read my Blog

 

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Deemiorgos

Thomas, the two sidings can

Thomas, the two sidings can each hold two 40 footers plus a 50 footer. The mainline behind the turnout can hold 4 cars plus a caboose. A total of 10 cars plus a caboose. I'm using a CN C424, but would rather have a RS 18, but no one makes a CN prototypical one. Though I model 1956, I started collecting trains appropriate for circa 1974 http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/15656?page=1that I fondly remenber. I had a piece of plywood left over from another project http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/14542?page=2and this is what I 'm making from it - a display/inglenook for my favorite 1974 era rolling stock. It's a little too heavy to take to a train show, but I'm stubborn enough to try. I will keep all informed.
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Prof_Klyzlr

Designing Inglenooks : The basic maths

Dear Splitrock,

Some basic maths:

Assume a 5:3:3 cannonical Inglenook

5 "units" (or cars, but lets work with units) for the long spur

+ 2 units for the main turnout toe <> clearance
(that's clearance, IE the point where 2 cars can stand side-by-side on adjacent tracks without sideswiping)

+ 3 units for cars on the tail track

+ 1 unit for the loco at the end of the tail track

= 5 + 2 + 3 + 1

= 11 units of linear length along the "longest route" which dictates the minimum benchwork
(assuming we're not using a cassette, sectorplate, or other subterfuge for the "tail track")

Assume 40' HO cars (and a 40' switcher like a SW7 thru 1500, or Alco S-series) @ 6" linear/car

= 66"

or 5' 6"

 

Redo for 50' HO cars (and a shorter GP15 or similar) @ 8" linear/car

= 88"

or 7' 4'
(blow it out to 8' for laughs)

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As per Carl Arendt's "how small can we shrink a 'nook and still have fun?" mission, lets redo for a 3:2:2 nook

Assume a 3:2:2 Inglenook

3 "units" (or cars, but lets work with units) for the long spur

+ 2 units for the main turnout toe <> clearance
(that's clearance, IE the point where 2 cars can stand side-by-side on adjacent tracks without sideswiping)

+ 2 units for cars on the tail track

+ 1 unit for the loco at the end of the tail track

= 3 + 2 + 2 + 1

= 8 units

Assume 40' HO cars (and a 40' switcher like a SW7 thru 1500, or Alco S-series) @ 6" linear/car

= 48"

or bang-on 4'
(grab yourself a 48x10 shelf at home depot,
slap down 3 lengths of PECO Code 83 "US Geometry" flextrack and 2x #6 turnouts,
and get operating!)

 

Redo for 50' HO cars (and a shorter GP15 or similar) @ 8" linear/car

= 64"

or 5' 4'
(blow it out to 6' for laughs)

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Consider the "Proto-nook"

As Iain Rice has been quoted:

"... a spur which holds 2.5 cars is no more use than a spur which holds 2 cars,
and significantly less useful than a spur which holds 3 at a pinch..."

Now, while we're not considering squeezing as many cars in each spur "just because we can",
this "...X # of cars, and a bit..." extra length of spur allows the inglenook "game" to hold methematically as far as car capacity goes,

while visually still allowing a good few inches of extra "spur length" which can work effectively to break up any feeling of "contrived spur length".

Furthur, by deploying Lance Mindheim-esque industry gates, fusees, derails,
(which all present themselves as possible animation modelling opportunities),

and "stop clear of grade crossing", conscious car-spot switching and other such operating rules,
(which despite the layout's micro size, still justify the deployment of "2-person ops crews"!?!?!?!!!)

the "that'll never feel like real switching" Inglenook arrangement "on a plank" can present (and operate) in either strict cannonical "game" mode, or in real-world "proto-nook" mode equally and easily as the whim and available crew dictates...

Hope this helps...

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

PS looks like Deem is using the Iain Rice-style "extra length" in his 5:3:3 nook spurs to allow a "mixed car set" of 40s and 50s....

 

Reply 0
Deemiorgos

Prof Kylzir, I didn't realize

Prof Kylzir, I didn't realize the potential my "display" layout will have in regards to operating; thanks! I think I'll eventually mount it to the wall with two brackets, but somehow with the ability to remove it easily so I can take it outdoors to photograph models on it. As for scenic ideas, I'm all ears, but keep in mind it is primarily used to display my favourite models and to photograph them; so nothing that would take away from them (though I do realize operations will have a great focus on the trains).
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splitrock323

Thanks Prof k

I understand the math and dimensions, what I don't understand is how you can mix 40 and 50 foot cars? I thought you should stick with similar length rolling stock and engines. I also thought Proto 1000 made RS-18's close to CN types. Thomas G

Thomas W. Gasior MMR

Modeling northern Minnesota iron ore line in HO.

YouTube: Splitrock323      Facebook: The Splitrock Mining Company layout

Read my Blog

 

Reply 0
ctxmf74

" mix 40 and 50 foot cars? "

The 1950's was  a time of change from 40 to 50 foot cars so both were quite common, by the 1960's even longer cars were often seen. Check the build dates on models and see which were new or which were old at the date you want to model, it's quite interesting to see how fast the rail car fleet developed after the end of steam operations........DaveB

Reply 0
Prof_Klyzlr

But, does a 'Nook _have_ to use common-length cars?

Dear Splitrock,

While the original Inglenook design and cannonical game rules are based on the premise that "all cars and loco the same length", that "car and a bit" design technique mentioned above is the key to allowing mixing carlengths within reason. Of course, if you start mixing carlengths at the extremes, you risk straying on the "Inglenook" side of the line, and furthur away from the "proto-nook" ethos. (while 2x drawbar-connected 22' ore hoppers might work mechanically/mathematically when spiced in the middle of an Inglenook based on 50' cars, they will likely look a little out-of-place...)

For many reasons, (era being a big one), it's unlikely that a given multi-carspot industry is going to run significantly differing length cars into a configured-with-defined-carspots spur.
- Warehouse doorsways generally don't move, and are deliberately spaced to fit multiples of a certain length car
- Oil and other liquid racks are equipped with driptrays and pipework at predicted multiples of given car length
- multi-car grain and ore/gravel unloaders tend to be engineered with pits at defined length multiples
- etc etc

However, the difference between 40 and 50' cars in HO is less than 2" linear, so enough "car and a bit" excess in 40' mode is more than enough to handle a "surprise" 50'er or 2, while not allowing anyone to "cheat" when using only/solely 40'ers...

Sidenote: I've seen plenty of 40' cars spotted at a warehouse with doors spaced for 50's, where the 40' cars were spotted uncoupled with a few feet gap between each car. However, I've yet to see 50'ers spotted in a continuous line at a warehouse with doors spaced for 40'ers...

Teamtracks and classification yards are the most plausible scenarios to see random-length cars spotted right next to each other on a spur. However, both scenarios also don't tend to "fit well" in a proto-nook, and as above, tend to lean more towards the "focus on the game rules, don't worry soo much about given prototype plausibility" Inglenook ethos.
(both approaches work, and can be a ton of fun, but it pays to know what your particular approach is,
and whether your perspective on a 'nook is more "Ingle" or "proto" ).

Can I suggest checking out the "Chicago Fork" article in the Sept MRH.
this layout plays host to 4x cars,
where one of the cars may be a 50'er, but the "nominal" car is a 40'er.

In extreme cases, a (shorter than 40') caboose can be added for a total of 5 cars, which is entirely do-able,
but starts to make operator's brain stretch a bit...

Also, due to the length of the tailtrack/sectorplate, 
"Chicago Fork" can host either 2x SW1500 switchers (80+' overall),
OR
a single 60-odd-feet of GP38 as motive power, and still "work" as designed.
(Variable length motive power can usually be easily handled,
as only the tail-track length need be adjusted to suit,
the "spur" capacities are not affected...).

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

PS : If you do happen to be more "Ingle" than "Proto", don't be afraid to go crazy with dbl-length cars. A close friend of mine had a On30 5:3:3 nook which featured a Girder load on a pair of flatcars. The resulting car was a "dbl length" unit, and factored as 2 "cars" for the purpose of Inglenook game capacity maths. Funnily enough, even with this "gotcha" car in play, there was only 1 move which was known to be incompatible with this car... (the car straddled the mainline turnout, making it impossible to throw, and thus completely locking up the layout... ).

 

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Deemiorgos

Phew! Just finished painting

Phew! Just finished painting the ties and rails... it took me all day. Next week I'll start to ballast. The ties ended up a little darker than I wanted, but I have to keep in mind I'm not doing my usual thing - old branch line track.

After the ballast is on and some weathering it should look better. 

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Reply 0
Bruce Petrarca

Before you ballast,

you might want to use some off-white and tan and even some olive green acrylic craft paint, seriously diluted to a wash to add some variation to the ties. It will lighten them up and cut down on the uniformity.

Bruce Petrarca, Mr. DCC; MMR #574

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Deemiorgos

Bruce, the poor lighting in

Bruce, the poor lighting in the photographs isn't showing the various colours and shades of colours of my ties. When you say diluted to a wash, do you mean applying a wash to the entire track or doing various different colour washes on various individual ties? I've lightly dry brushed ties in the past as seen here http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/14040?page=3 to create highlights and to fade some of the ties. I might do this again, but more so in regards to drybrushing and only on the spurs. I'm basically using the same technique I did before, but with Peco track instead of ME. I must admit, I still like the look of how the ME turned out, which I think looks more realistic. The paint and washes on the Peco flex track seem to hide the grain/details. Also the spikes look a bit oversized, but they are correct according to Peco..
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Deemiorgos

Salt storage shed

I'm thinking of putting a Kadee magnet on my inglenook, but want to hide the unsightly thing so I'm thinking of putting a salt storage shed in front of it and and pole on the other side of the track as an indicator where the magnet is.

I'm going to use this little white shed to hide the other turnout's not so prototypical looking points and ties that hold the switching stand.

For the likes of me I can't find any images of what a salt storage shed (the type that stores salt for the roads in the winter) looks like on the net. Any help would be much appreciated.

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Bruce Petrarca

I was talking about individual ties!

Dry brush or wash - similar results!

Too bad about the lighting.

Bruce Petrarca, Mr. DCC; MMR #574

Reply 0
Deemiorgos

I"ll do both Bruce - drybrush

I"ll do both Bruce - drybrush and wash. I'd like to take it outdoors to photograph it in natural light, but it's cold and soon will be wet out. Cheers.
Reply 0
Deemiorgos

Today for the first time in

Today for the first time in just over two years, I finally got to run a train... and before xmas at that!

My inglenook is ready for ballasting and scenery. It's all wired up. Still deciding I I want to put a decoupling magnet on the track.

Now I have something to play with while working on my modular layout.

Will put ACI plates on the loco soon and a bell.

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Reply 0
Dave O

Congratulations!

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Deemiorgos

Thanks Dave. I'm so looking

Thanks Dave. I'm so looking forward to doing the scenery. Still looking for ideas and some kind of narrow structure to hide a decoupling magnet. I'll put a pole on the other side of the track as a guide to where the magnet is.
Reply 0
Jon In Krakow

Done this myself

Quote:

PS : If you do happen to be more "Ingle" than "Proto", don't be afraid to go crazy with dbl-length cars. A close friend of mine had a On30 5:3:3 nook which featured a Girder load on a pair of flatcars. The resulting car was a "dbl length" unit, and factored as 2 "cars" for the purpose of Inglenook game capacity maths. Funnily enough, even with this "gotcha" car in play, there was only 1 move which was known to be incompatible with this car... (the car straddled the mainline turnout, making it impossible to throw, and thus completely locking up the layout... ).

 

 

I do this mixed-sized Inglenook myself. My daughter and I play with an Eastern German Piko set (on LifeLike PowerLoc track, nonetheless!) and we have two passenger cars she likes to use sometimes when we play. When we use them, instead of the standard 8 wagons, we use 7, and count both cars as one in the card game part. Here's a pic on another forum I posted years ago when we first started. She's older now, and wants the track on a permanent layout board, and scenicked.  

http://www.freerails.com/view_topic.php?id=2029&forum_id=40

How we play. I photographed all the cars (and each one is unique), and printed them out as cards. We shuffle the stack, and pull out five of them (or four, if one of them is the passenger set), and then she runs the throttle and tells me what to put and where, and I do the uncoupling and track switching. Sometimes we switch roles, and she does the fiddly bits while I do the throttle. I don't remember ever having gotten into a situation where we locked up the tracks doing this. 

If I were to do what the OP is doing, though, I would make the tracks long enough to hold 2 50ft cars, and one 40 ft. That would give the most flexibility without allowing "cheating" I would think.

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Deemiorgos

My two sidings can hold two

My two sidings can hold two 50 foot cars plus a 40 foot car, Jon. It might fit three 50 foot cars, but I'm not at home to check. I like that you took photos of your rolling stock and made cards out of them. Cheers
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Jon In Krakow

My two sidings can hold two

Quote:

My two sidings can hold two 50 foot cars plus a 40 foot car, Jon. It might fit three 50 foot cars, but I'm not at home to check.

I like that you took photos of your rolling stock and made cards out of them.

I figured that was how you did things.

I like how the photos turned out. My daughter does as well. Here's a sample:

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Deemiorgos

Nice card Jon. I got all my

Nice card Jon. I got all my cars out of the box and will take pics of them soon. I still have to scenic the inglenook, but now am putting the finishing touches on them before I do such as ACI plates, details, etc. I just finished last week a CN loco (3214) for the inglenook as seen here on this page: http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/16254?page=1
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Deemiorgos

Finally got the computer up

Finally got the computer up and running so I can post pics.

Put some dirt and gravel on the inglenook today. As it stands now it is just a base for scenery. The higher mounds will eventually have grass and weeds. after it dries I will apply a thin colour wash over the dirt then later a little dry-brushing and chalk powder to try to the look that is in the first photo.

The area where the track angles off, I will build up and pave it.

The last scenic thing I will do is apply the ballast to the track.

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