Bonus - Down by the Shore in Hoboken trackplan

Byron,

This looks like an interesting plan with potential for operation with 1 or 2 crews active at a time.

What heights would be appropriate for the visible trackage and the 'hidden' tracks and for the top of the 'sub-backdrop' behind the NY port authority? I'd be concerned about the lack of visibility.

If the oil dealer and the NY Port Authority stuff moved 'right' a few inches would it be possible to add another 'staging' track to the continuous run track?

Nice work!

Charlie Comstock

Charlie said:
This looks like an interesting plan with potential for operation with 1 or 2 crews active at a time.

That's generally the plan for operations. One could come up with three operating roles: HBS "yard" job working the visible Erie interchange in the Park Ave yard and the nearby industires, another HBS crew working the Maxwell House and car float area, and a third Erie/HBS op working the Erie active staging and the area south of Castle Point. But the aisles don't really suport it.

The owner's goal is a couple of operators with throttles, maybe adding a roving brakeman and possibly a clerk/yardmaster in the workbench area or an adjacent room.

What heights would be appropriate for the visible trackage and the 'hidden' tracks and for the top of the 'sub-backdrop' behind the NY port authority? I'd be concerned about the lack of visibility.

All the trackage is planned to be at roughly the same elevation (right now, he's thinking 44") ... maybe some small gradients at each end of the Park Ave. yard into the "bowl" and a slight gradient toward the car float. Top of the backdrop at NY Port Authority will be just above eye height for the owner, with a long angled mirror on the wall above the staging tracks a la the Reid Brothers' N scale Cumberland Valley. The owner will be able to reach the staging tracks on a stool reaching over, or the backdrop will be removeable if you can't pull the wounded to safety. There's also a (hopefully rarely used) pop up at the top of the drawing.

If the oil dealer and the NY Port Authority stuff moved 'right' a few inches would it be possible to add another 'staging' track to the continuous run track?

Could be, but I was really conscious of aisle widths, and this is already a little tighter than I prefer. The continuous run will not be used for regular operations, so there are two usable Erie staging tracks, which is enough for the operating scheme and level of intensity envisioned. "Extra" cars will be stored on shelves in the workbench/closet area, not on the layout itself.

Thanks for the interest and questions!

Byron

There seems not to be much interest in my layout design in MRH #1. That's the way it goes ... I guess it's more interesting for this audience to talk about the programming and formatting minutiae of MRH than model railroading.

But I did get one email asking about the double-slip "puzzle" switch that was found at the track interface to the car float on the real-life Hoboken Shore. This was a bit of a signature feature of the real railroad and the emailer wondered why I left it off the plan. The simple answer is that this track plan was done for a client and he was uncomfortable with the possible construction and maintenance complexity of this track component.

Byron,

 I guess you explained everything well enough in the article! And since the magazine promotion is kinda focused on - and has emphasized - the rich media aspect, it's to be expected for most of the commentary early on to be looking at that.

I believe your article was the only one that Joe didn't send out to the editing crew for an overview - whether that was an oversight or simply confidence in your abilites as an author, I don't know. But it did make for a pleasant surprise to discover an article in the magazine that I hadn't seen yet!

One thing that interests me is the liftout/swing - have you any actual benchwork design on how to implement that?

Jeff said:
I believe your article was the only one that Joe didn't send out to the editing crew for an overview - whether that was an oversight or simply confidence in your abilites as an author, I don't know. But it did make for a pleasant surprise to discover an article in the magazine that I hadn't seen yet!

Yeah, I only rated the "bonus section" this time ... maybe I'll make it to the big-kids table next issue.   ;^)

Or you may not have seen it because I was kind of late turning it in!

One thing that interests me is the liftout/swing - have you any actual benchwork design on how to implement that?

I didn't design anything for this particular layout, the client is confident that he can make it work. He's just planning on a simple lift-out registered and locked with removable-pin door hinges, since it won't be closed very often.

Rick Fortin's layout uses a very secure latching system based on four modified over-center clasps from the hardware store. The clasps are attached to the fixed sides and the "tabs" (for lack of a better term) are on the bottom of the liftout. The clasps pull the lift-out (which is a tight fit) into place and hold it firm. These are metal, so he also uses them to supply DCC power to the liftout (which has two tracks). Although he has not done so yet, we have talked about powering a stretch of track on either side through the latched lift-out in order to provide a safety.

The lift-out at Rick's is between the crew lounge and the layout -- so once you're in the layout, you never have to pass through again to follow a train. The lift-out stays in pace for the whole session, being removed only for the lunch break and at the end of the session ... so it's a duckunder during the session itself. For this area that has fairly high traffic of trains and people, it's important that it be rock-solid so nobody bangs it out of place just as the "Valley Super C" is passing overhead.

Rick has also placed handrails below the lift-out deck to help folks duck under when the lift-out is locked in place. This a great idea I always recommend for any duckunder.

For a situation where the lift-out must be negotiated to follow a train's path, or is lower and harder to optionally duckunder, obviously hinges work well. Most of the time, setting it up so that gravity holds it in place for trains and a human has to lift or swing it for passage is best ... as we say on Rick's crew, "Gravity is not just a good idea: it's the law!"

Byron,

I thought I remembered from my visit to Rick Fortin's a number of years ago that he had a pit with steps up and down on either side of the lift out to avoid the need to duck. Is my memory even further gone than I thought or are the steps and pit there but not used?

Charlie

Charlie, yep, you remember correctly, there is a five-foot-deep pit at the room entrance excavated below the floor level and built with concrete steps. In the final layout configuration, operators will be able to walk down 4 (I think) steps, nod under the layout, then step back up to the floor level. The pit is still there, but it is bridged by floor at this time to make it easy to move supplies, large tools like the band saw, and such in and out of the train room. Once the heavy construction is done, the idea was to remove the floor over the pit and the lift-out bridge would be in place permanently.

But Rick is now thinking about leaving the duckunder/lift-out because the steps down and back up will be their own inconvenience. Nice to have the option, though!

The construction of Rick's layout room (and the pit) were discussed in Layout Design Journal #19 (Winter 1998) published by the Layout Design SIG.

Let me be the first to post to your article who isn't one of the "Siskiyou insiders"!  I found this to be a REALLY interesting article, but I have to confess this is primarily because I'm building a 10 x 12 HBS layout myself.  I was impressed with your thoughts to allow for a continuous run on this layout primarily becasue I figured anyone with interest in the prototype would be a switching fiend like myself!

My version will be set in the early 70's, with a little license taken to keep a reasonable level of traffic on the layout to maintain interest.  I really enjoyed your article because it's interesting to see how a different set of eyes (albeit FAR more experiecned ones than mine) are able to come up with a vasty different operting philosphy than I could.

Thanks for the compelling read and I look forward to more articles in the future!

I'm glad you enjoyed the article. My client does indeed enjoy switching the most, but once in a while he also likes to "watch 'em run".

Post your plan here sometime and we can have a discussion of the different approaches taken. Best of luck with your HBS!

Byron-

I should mention here you've motivated me to start posting about my layout progress.  If you're curious, it can be found here

Byron, Just in case you are unaware, Miller Engineering has THE Maxwell House Coffee sign to put on top of the Coffee building.

I bought one for my Coffee roasting plant and it is a very nice sign, as all their signs are.

Mark G

The original was sized to be seen across the Hudson River, so the Miler Engineering sign is a litle small. But it's so cool!

I've emailed my client, he may want to use it anyway since the Maxwell House buildings on the model are compressed, too. Thanks!

Here's the Miller Engineering Maxwell House sign (from their website)

And a photo of the original from their site

Here's a great Flickr photoset of the destruction and subsequent remediation of the Maxwell House plant into high-end condos - http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdalton/sets/72157606299861046/

In regards to layout planning, in this particular case, a Port Series map is indispensible.

RAH