The most useful and possibly

The most useful and possibly succinct article of the series so far, but still no new ground being plowed on the subject of operations. 

Good info

I think this article presents some good info and some of it will be useful for my industrial railroad layout. I use a lot of what Lance Mindheim describes for his operations, especially making certain to slow things down and not rush anything to help replicate prototypical operations.

Caniac

I think you hit on exactly the purpose of the article - useful and succinct. 

There wasn't any reason to re-invent the wheel, just put it in a form that someone who might not have seen it before could use. 

I think if we want to interest new people in operations,

we need useful and succint articles that may not cover "new ground".  

Succint

Yeah but we have four article so far and there really hasn't been any description of how to set one up on your layout.  Other than just swap out cars one for one or pick up whatever you want.  If you pulled somebody who had never operated before and gave them all of those articles, could they set a coherent operating scheme on a  model railroad?

I could because I know what all those operating methods are and how they work.  If you didn't know what a tag on car system was, would you be able to set one up on your layout?  What options do you have for tags?  How do you mark the tag to route the car?  How do you know where to send the car?   Do any of these articles help you set that up?

How do you set up a list?  How do I operate a layout with a list?  What does a list look like?  How does it work with a freight train?  Do any of these articles help you set that up?

The articles are a nice overview, but don't really help anybody actually implement operations.  Maybe that's not what the intent was.  I still think that at some point somebody needs to actually tell people who want to operate there layout this is how you can set it up.  To use it, you do A, B, C, D.  This method is good for this, this method is better for that.

Cookbook style

Dave what you're talking about is what we call a "cookbook" style article. Here's the recipe, gather the ingredients, then follow along as I show you exactly how to go from the raw ingredients to a fully baked operational solution.

None of these articles have been cookbook style. They've been what I would call "topical education" style. Here's the concepts, so let's educate you on what the ideas are. How to actually implement this? That's left to the reader to figure out once you know the concepts.

The author for this series has a history writing for the Ops SIG and he has a very good handle on the concepts and explaining them in plain English. 

But the Ops SIG in general prefers topical education materials -- and we always need good topical education materials. On the other hand, the cookbook style is great for getting total beginners started, but I have yet to see the Ops SIG take that approach with anything. 

I asked some Ops SIG leadership one time about doing more tutorial cookbook style articles or books -- and they said that's not really their charter. Uh, okay ... ??

I sense the Ops SIG leaders more see their reason for being to push the envelope on advanced ops techniques and to facilitate sessions where those advanced ops techniques can be tried, tested, and refined. As for the beginner end of the ops continuum, they're not really into the simple end of ops -- that's both too simplistic and also a lot of hard work trying to build cookbook tutorials for beginners on simple stuff.

Cookbook

Well I'm an OpSig member and I wrote an overview article 3 years ago and you turned it down and asked me to rewrite it and a year ago I wrote cookbook article and you turned it down and said try again next year in the summer.

I wouldn't blame the OpSig, they have plenty of "cookbook" articles in the Dispatch Office.

I am re-writing the cookbook article (in the process of generating the illustrations and diagrams) and (per your instructions) will resubmit it a month or so.

I am describing 4 methods, 2 non-car specific and 2 car specific.

Does the MRH have a files section that can support Excel type files to be downloaded?  I am planning on having switch list and other type document templates.

Yes

Yep, the bonus downloads for each issue is the perfect place for files like that.

And as for your cookbook articles, some approaches work and some don't. For whatever reason, I didn't feel your approach at the time was working. But I'm willing to work with you to get something that does work here on take #3.

I appreciate your perseverance.

@Russ

There are already two books designed for newcomers to operations -- Chubb's classic and Koester's. Both are quite adequate at helping the reader grasp operations in a logical, easy to assimilate manner. This series did not improve on information in either book -- no new ground plowed. 

Dave H. is correct: an article or series on how to set up types of operations is needed.

Yes, but ...

Yes, but we get about 2000 new readers per year and MRH is free, while those other sources are not free. For hobby newcomers (or experienced modelers as well) who may not be aware of what's possible, this series just might open some eyes.

Sometimes replowing old ground can be useful as well, especially in a free publication. Just don't overdo that or we'll loose the savvy modelers because everything then becomes old news.

how big would a "cook book" style article be?

If it is too big, I'm wondering about an operations column?  I'm visualising a column that begins at the beginning and adds something new each month so that each month becomes like a new chapter in a book.  

I'm thinking that an article that takes most of an issue would probably turn off modelers that have been doing operations for years, but it may not be possible to cover the subject adequately in a shorter article.  If it were done in small bites each month with next month building on the previous month, the "old hands" could skip that column if they found it too basic, but it might hold interest for someone who wanted to learn operations.  I think it should be in the free section of the magazine rather than RE.

Series yes, column no

I'm not enthusiastic about a column on a topic that routinely gets lower ratings. About 1/3rd of readers are interested in ops, but 2/3rds are not and you won't change that by very much I suspect. I personally love ops and ops articles, but most readers don't like a lot of ops content.

A column is a huge commitment, both on the part of the author and for us as the publisher because that means part of the magazine is permanently gone for other topics. We can't just make the magazine(s) bigger because right now MRH + RE just fits production timewise into 30 days.

I would much rather see a multi-part series. Something with a beginning, and middle, and an end. Then we can give the topic a rest for a while and do another series on the topic later.

Series - yes, column - no. I agree MRH is the best target publication for cookbook ops articles for the most part.

Size

A couple thousand words for each method would probably do it.

Part of the problem with operations is that other than the underlying "physical" parameters (how many industries, what cars they use, what "exits" there are off the layout) there isn't that much that is transferrable between different methods.  The exceptions being those that can replicate a waybill can be combined with those that replicate a list.  There isn't really a "progression" from A to B to C to D, they are mostly, parallel but separate tracks.

If there is a progression its managing the operation by car type, then car number, then by shipment, then by a prototype methods.  But the hardware doesn't necessarily follow along.  In most cases when you leap from one step to the next the hardware is obsolete, especially at the beginning.

On the train movement side, there is TT&TO and then everything else can start out as "mother may I" and then add complexity to go into CTC, DTC, TWC, OCS, etc.  The odd duck is Rule 251 that isn't really TT&TO but really isn't "mother may I".

Not very long at all, Done you have the basics

Not very long at all how hard is it to fill out a car card 

5 lines at the most

AAR Code or Type of car  _BX_
Road Name                       _ATSF_
Car Number                      _123456_
Herald                               _Santa Fe_
Color                                 _Brown_

Make a Way bill

Turn 1
To:   My Widget factory on my layout

Turn 2
To:   Dollar Widget Sales warehouse in (Any Place US/Off the Layout)

Make a Switch Listing if CC&WB is too scary,  Still the same Basic information played out in a vertical form with from and to or drops and spots and pulls etc.

Done, You have the basics

That hardest part is figuring out what you Receive and Ship on your layout.

Hmmm Thinking...  I have a Building that says Sunkist Packing...  Maybe it would receive Packing Crates or Boxes in a BX or XM car and Ship Lemons in a R or Refer car of some type.

If you are not sure how to fill out a car card?  All the information and more is conveniently printed on the side of almost every US based rail car.

If you can tell your kid to go to Circle K on their Bike and Buy a pack of gum and a Slurpee you can set up operations.  

The issue is people that have not looked into operation make it into something that is overinflated, sounds super scary and like work.  Maybe Monopoly, Chess and Bingo are to hard for you,  but that is the basics of operations it is a game, with things the represent objects and places.

If you can look at a car tittle, registration and follow a map to an address,  That is all Car Cards are, it is the Title and Registration for the Rail Car.  Way Bill is the Map and Address where you plan on driving to in your car or sending the Rail Car too.

And you can go simpler that, just  do Tabs on Cars or Same Car Type replacement etc.

You are now a qualified expert into basic operations

Joe, then use those books as

Joe, then use those books as springboards for what you're really trying to accomplish, which is increasing knowledge and interest in prototype operations among beginning- and intermediate-level modelers while breaking down long-standing biases against prototype operations.

Apart from the copyright issues, which I do think could be amicably dealt with via asking permission, does it really matter for the good of the hobby that Kalmbach Media has a significant head start on teaching and inspiring modelers on this topic? If OPSIG won't carry the water and MRH wants to, by all means do so, but actively include Chubb's "How to Operate Your Model Railroad" and Koester's "Realistic Model Railroad Operations" as part of the "curriculum."

Everybody wins, right?

Certainly

Yes, certainly. Bruce isn't getting any younger but we've talked about him wanting to update his book and have MRH publish it this time since Kalmbach has declined.

"Yes, certainly. Bruce isn't

"Yes, certainly. Bruce isn't getting any younger but we've talked about him wanting to update his book and have MRH publish it this time since Kalmbach has declined."

What an excellent idea! So many possibilities for updates, enhancements, etc.

A bit disappointed, but not surprised, that KMC declined. There's certainly a lot to question over there. Shrinking staff and page count at MR and MRP, and a shrinking number of mag titles under KMC. They are still a force to be reckoned with as a competitor, but how long will they be #1?

Beginning ops and OpSig

Exactly why I let my OpSig membership expire.

Steve Kristoff

Lots of Boo Hoo,  and little

Lots of Boo Hoo,  and little tiny tears.

What you are saying?  You want OpSig to cater to beginners?  It would be the same thing as telling MRH to have a ballast article in every publication.

How often to do we hear people say that MR is too beginner?  or MRH caters to the advanced and more skilled model railroader?

OpSig.org like MRH caters to the more Advanced and discerning Model Railroad Operator.  

If you want to see a beginner How to Operate stuff.  Check out MR and MRVP they have several articles and videos on basic operations for lower skilled people.

The information is out their.   Or just call up and join an operator group,  watch YouTube, Subscribe to MR and MRVP.  The information is available you are just unwilling to look or do the research for your self.  That might be the entire problem.  People are not willing to put in the research, they want someone else to do the work for them, and when it is given to them they are not happy with the presented information.  You do no like it? do your own foot work.

Beginner

I was one told that you are only a beginner once and after that you spend the rest of your life improving your skills.

OpSig Wesite :  Operations 101

It has an 8 part Powerpoint presentation on beginner operations.  Plus there is another pdf summary of operations.

OpSig Website :  Miscellaneous Links

There are over 3 dozen links to all sort of presentations and information on all facets of operations.  Much of it oriented towards the beginner.  Some of it oriented towards the more advanced operator.

Steve K : What specifically are you looking for that's not in that information?

@Dave1905

Thanks - I don't believe I'd seen those before. Going through the Potomac Division clinic now.