More uses for the Locomotive as Load

Great article.

I did a similar thing 2 years ago when I saw the prototype pulling a well used GP7. In this instance the engine was not dead but used more as a "slug" with the windows boarded up. A easy way to add power and interest to any modern consist.  

I noticed the pristine condition of the locomotive you used, Often we are able to find locomotives that have burnt out engines, paint flaws and so forth in the used or scrap section of hobby stores or online.

These finds are also a great model in which to practice weathering a locomotive if the thought of taking paint to a new locomotive intimidates you.

Thanks,

Peter

--
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"Heavy Weather"
Rust, Dirt, Grime and Graffiti for you model trains
http://www.heavytrainweather.blogspot.com/

Locomotives as load

I remember seeing many engines moving from Saginaw toward Grand Rapids (Michigan) in the early 70's. These were apparently going to the paint shop to become Chessie System engines. All I remember were they were not running and the stacks were covered up.

Tom Carson

A prototype note

On NS, when a locomotive is moved dead in tow, it will be moved one of two ways.  If it has working brakes which are compatible with a 26L or electronic brake valve, and MU capability, it will be moved as the rear unit in a consist.  If it does not have MU capability, or for some reason the brake valve will not work with a modern brake valve, it will be moved behind a spacer car.

You may already know all this, but the brakes on a locomotive are direct air brakes (not indirect, as on a freight car) and depend on main reservoir pressure to work.  One of the MU hoses directly connects the main reservoirs on every locomotive in a consist, so that all will have pressure and therefore brakes.  Whenever possible, a dead locomotive is moved this way as well, because it gives the engineer the ability to control the brakes and generally works the way a locomotive brake system is designed to work.

If for some reason that won't work, the locomotive is put behind a spacer car, and the "Dead in Train" cutout cock opened.  That opens the main reservoir to the brake pipe, much like a freight car's reservoir.  While the pressure won't be as high as it would with the engine running, it's better than nothing.  The brakes are set up to work just like a freight car's, applying as the brake pipe pressure drops, and releasing when it rises again.  The reason for the spacer car is to prevent the engineer from accidentally connecting the main reservoir MU hose with the dead in train valve open.

What this means to us as modelers is that we can move a locomotive in two different ways.  You could even have an all Alco short line moving an RS-1 in the consist, but having to put it behind a spacer car for a class 1 RR.

Great Information

Thanks for your posting Ken. Great information! Great sidebar to a nicely done article by Matt. Good stuff all around.

Great, but...

I did some checking as I am working on a project for a buddy of mine. Some Saudi units shipped from EMD to Saudi Arabia did not have plywood on windows, and had EMD numbers placed over the Saudi numbers: http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=331201&nseq=2 Furthermore the units shipped were not wrapped for trans-ocean shipping: http://www.angelsfeartotread.com/2010/10/sd70acs-locomotives/

I told my buddy to make a post on this, as he has pictures other than what the two above guys took. He said that over the years, the shipping methods have changed, with some units having shipped out on rail with wrapping similar to that used on boats for winter storage or transport. Having lived in Erie PA, I have also never seen plywood used in a lash up that went out. I think I have seen the wrapping, but it has been a few years since I was near the GE spur.

Stogie

The pictures from second link didn't show the entire ship.

From what I could glimpse of it, it appears to be a relatively small "break bulk" ship of the sort that used to be known as a "tramp steamer."  After those locomotives are loaded into the hold and lashed so that they can't shift, a water tight hatch cover is put on and "dogged" down.  If a locomotive were carried on deck, any cab windows would be covered to protect them from breaking and the locomotive wrapped in some way to protect it from the ravages of weather at sea. 

When I was in the Coast Guard at school in Groton Connecticut, I was told about the 255 foot cutter that was stationed in New London.  It was in effect 10 years newer than any other 255 in the Coast Guard fleet because it had run into a storm in the North Atlantic.  When it limped back into port, the keel was broken, all of the paint from the bridge forward was gone, and the 5" gun was lashed to the deck.  Water is a powerful force!

I suspect that any locomotive shipped today will have plywood covering the windows for the same reason that auto racks are now enclosed.  There are just too many vandals who think anything on a train is a nice target to throw rocks at and the railroads provide all of that nice ballast that is perfect for rock throwing.

Slugs a B-units

Bit of a nitpick, but a "B-unit" and slug are two very different things.

A slug has only traction motors and no engine. Power to the traction motors is provided from the "mother" unit's main generator. Some railroads use road slugs that have a working control cab; yard slugs have cut down bodies for visibility from the mother unit.

SD70ACs to Saudi Arabia

Russ,

I don't know about the wrapping on board, but from what I could find and what the images posted show is that the SD70ACs shipped in 2010 did not have plywood protecting the windows. This included rail transit. GE in Erie stored new locos on a track with no plywood, wrap or other protection beyond a fenced in area.

Stogie

New locos in transit

Great article!  I was going to add a note that before mega-mergers and the like that locomotives were often delivered dead in tow to their new owners.  US locos are now usually delivered under their own power, but as a poster here noted, export locos like those headed for Saudi Arabia can still be seen dead in tow.  The part of the PRR that I model saw many shipments from Baldwin of both steamers and diesels, and I plan to model both.  One will be an AT&SF 4-10-2 headed west (ironically the same locos that the PRR leased back in 1956!) and the others will be 2 VO1000s, one for the US Transportation Corp and the other for Northern Pacific.  In 1944, these were shipped with plywood over the windows and headlights, canvas covers over the stacks and in the case of the steamer, main rods off.  Most of them also had a placard telling the world that this was a BLW product.

Another group of locos to consider are those too small to efficiently travel over mainline rails, or narrow or wide gauge locos.  These would be shipped as flat car loads, making another interesting movement.

One word of caution, however - these are "oddballl" loads and I would think that you need to be carefull how often they appear on the layout as they might get, well, boring...

-Bruce Smith

One word of caution, however

Unless, of course, you have an on-layout locomotive leasing or repair company.  Then they could see all sorts of interesting traffic.  Another good traffic generator might be a railroad museum.  I remember a few years ago, when the Graham County Shay went to California, it left Spencer, NC on a flat car and covered with a big blue tarp.  Even though it's standard gauge, there's no way to take the rods off and it would have taken forever to get it there on its own wheels.  It came back a few weeks later (I got to set it out at Linwood) minus the tarp - no idea who stole that.  We've also seen the FP7 and E8 at Linwood, since I think they have to go to Roanoke (or is it Juniata now?) for some sort of service on occasion.

As for new locomotives, the VRE has been getting some new passenger locomotives, and I see them fairly frequently in Lynchburg, VA, on a train headed to Manassas.  They're never used in power as far as I know - just the rear trailing unit in the consist.  I also remember when the NCDOT got it's first F59PHI - it went to Raleigh as the rear unit on train 350, making that one of the rare occasions as a conductor that I wished I could go to Raleigh.

Another idea

I finally got to read my Railway Age from August (I believe that was it anyway). CN is experimenting with distributed power. Unlike mid-train helpers, the DP use un-manned locomotives mid train to assist when needed. It may be easier to use a weighted dummy in this application, but it might be interesting as well.

stogie

Slugs and B-Units

Hello,

Either way, this can be an interesting addition to a train's consist and an interesting modeling challenge.

Cheers,

Peter

The secret is enough weight on the train.

It may be easier to use a weighted dummy in this application, but it might be interesting as well.

A friend of mine used to be a member of the La Mesa Club at the San Diego before he went to work for Athearn and found that he got al of the model railroading he wanted at work.  I asked him how they ran long trains with mid-train helpers without derailment problems.  He told me that as long as there was enough weight either in front of or behind the locomotive, they will work fine together.  He also said that any locomotive will run with any other locomotive as long as there is enough weight to make them work.  I think he told me that an S.P. cab forward model would pull 27-30 typical cars on the Tehachapi grades, so if you had 50-60 cars on the train, you could run a helper without problems.  The loco in the lead would pull the first 25-30 cars, and the other loco would pull or push the back 25-30 depending on whether it was a pusher or a mid train helper.

Correction

Correction, looks like it is CP that is utilizing distributed power. CN had been favoring head end power until an accident due to in-train forces. If I read it right, CN is limiting train length to 8500ft and expanding DP usage. CP on the other hand is well into experimental work.

The units used in DP are conventional locomotives, not B or slug units.

Locomotives as Loads

A good article based on "scrap" locomotives.  As mentioned, this was also done to move locomotives to shops for inspection and maintenance.  In the 1970's Southern Ry. used passenger trains for this purpose.  See:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=56839

Here is the southbound Piedmont with 8 engines and being led by Southern's only Alco RS11, still lettered for Carolina & North Western.  As it happens, it will come back lettered for Southern and will be gone in another year.

Thanks,

Tim

I have added my photos to my blog.

Hello,

For those of you who were looking, I have added the photo's of my locomotive as "load" to my blog page.

Link is in the signature.

Cheers,

Peter.

Locomotives As Loads? (MRH 2011 09 Sept)

Woo-hoo! Now I have a use for that old rubber band-drive locomotive I was given several years ago!

I'm also a little behind in my reading. 

Best regards.  Brian